Who Tarnished the Image of Pakistan?
Xari Jalil July 13, 2005
#45 Posted by arjun_m on July 21, 2005 4:53:34 am
#44 by sifzal on July 20, 2005 6:24pm PT
but Pakistan all fully sovereign to make decision on its on!.
mmmkay...the paki generals make the decision to allow the US military to kill pakis on paki soil...
riiiight
Pakistani Generals on their own entered into only Kargil and your general went on saying that Indian soldiers are being killed like stray dogs, had it not been your master you would have learned lot more lesson.
your generals never told you why, if India was losing in Kargil, did Nawaz Sharif had to rush to Washington on the 4th of july..and that too uninvited...most non-pakis would expect the leader of the losing side to rush to washington to beg for intervention... Of course, the question wouldn`t arise with most non-pakis who, seeing that India holds the land that was in contention in the Kargil war, would treat that as kind of a defeat for pakiland....
but Pakistan all fully sovereign to make decision on its on!.
mmmkay...the paki generals make the decision to allow the US military to kill pakis on paki soil...
riiiight
Pakistani Generals on their own entered into only Kargil and your general went on saying that Indian soldiers are being killed like stray dogs, had it not been your master you would have learned lot more lesson.
your generals never told you why, if India was losing in Kargil, did Nawaz Sharif had to rush to Washington on the 4th of july..and that too uninvited...most non-pakis would expect the leader of the losing side to rush to washington to beg for intervention... Of course, the question wouldn`t arise with most non-pakis who, seeing that India holds the land that was in contention in the Kargil war, would treat that as kind of a defeat for pakiland....
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#44 Posted by sifzal on July 20, 2005 6:24:27 pm
Re: # 42
So you find it amazing that a person who has attended over 100 workshops participated by on average 30-40 companies, and seminars all around the world since 1987 is unable to recall name of the one participating company back in 1996! ... I knew I am wasting time here...
Your and arjun statements suggest that unlike me, you believe in might is right, that was the reason first you insisted England to be your masters even after 1947 independence of yours and annexed illegally many states even after accepting either them as part of Pakistan or remain independent, under the same master you were able to get into Kashmir. Then you found another master USSR and now USA, so whatever the Master does you find logics to justify it, and blame all on the others like in Taliban case you feel US justified ``had to do it`` but Pakistan all fully sovereign to make decision on its on!. Pakistani Generals on their own entered into only Kargil and your general went on saying that Indian soldiers are being killed like stray dogs, had it not been your master you would have learned lot more lesson.
Come out of this slave mentality if you understand the meaning of freedom and learn to be friends, than slaves...but I know you will never understand for you are not free in mind as yet or in spirit and will keep harping the tune of your masters...Have reverence for Pakistan, for this is the land from which civilization entered into the land you now call India - the name you stole from the motherland Pakistan (India name is associated with Indus Valley; at the time of independence you tricked Jinnah and Mountbatin also mentioned Jinnah was furious...remember India was to be divided into Pakistan and Bharat...look partition time maps). You fall for glitter and not in a habit of doing research to know the truth behind!
Talk on BCCI and the name of the companies of international repute, first take the name of the relatively small company in Pakistan that has been exporting auto-parts to Korea, its Spel group of companies… coming to the next, I will respond when you will learn how to behave and use words while writing.
So you find it amazing that a person who has attended over 100 workshops participated by on average 30-40 companies, and seminars all around the world since 1987 is unable to recall name of the one participating company back in 1996! ... I knew I am wasting time here...
Your and arjun statements suggest that unlike me, you believe in might is right, that was the reason first you insisted England to be your masters even after 1947 independence of yours and annexed illegally many states even after accepting either them as part of Pakistan or remain independent, under the same master you were able to get into Kashmir. Then you found another master USSR and now USA, so whatever the Master does you find logics to justify it, and blame all on the others like in Taliban case you feel US justified ``had to do it`` but Pakistan all fully sovereign to make decision on its on!. Pakistani Generals on their own entered into only Kargil and your general went on saying that Indian soldiers are being killed like stray dogs, had it not been your master you would have learned lot more lesson.
Come out of this slave mentality if you understand the meaning of freedom and learn to be friends, than slaves...but I know you will never understand for you are not free in mind as yet or in spirit and will keep harping the tune of your masters...Have reverence for Pakistan, for this is the land from which civilization entered into the land you now call India - the name you stole from the motherland Pakistan (India name is associated with Indus Valley; at the time of independence you tricked Jinnah and Mountbatin also mentioned Jinnah was furious...remember India was to be divided into Pakistan and Bharat...look partition time maps). You fall for glitter and not in a habit of doing research to know the truth behind!
Talk on BCCI and the name of the companies of international repute, first take the name of the relatively small company in Pakistan that has been exporting auto-parts to Korea, its Spel group of companies… coming to the next, I will respond when you will learn how to behave and use words while writing.
#43 Posted by bbabu on July 19, 2005 12:42:17 pm
arjun_m #40
`` Name one Pakistani company that can hold it`s own in the world..an equivalent to Infosys or Wipro...or reliance or Moser-Baer....``
I thought BCCI was a good Pakistani company until they were exposed to be crooks and criminals.
`` Name one Pakistani company that can hold it`s own in the world..an equivalent to Infosys or Wipro...or reliance or Moser-Baer....``
I thought BCCI was a good Pakistani company until they were exposed to be crooks and criminals.
#42 Posted by bbabu on July 19, 2005 12:40:51 pm
sifzal #39
````Name the company. You conveniently dodged the question twice. ````
`` There are many companies manufacturing and exporting auto components including those for Suzuki in Pakistan. The workshop (1996) I referred to was also attended by many companies, and I do not remember names of the companies exporting those components as that was not the primary motive for me as an organizer and a moderator. Nevertheless, the person who revealed this information in the workshop was, to the best of my memory, Almas Haider (I recall his name because we played tennis once together in Lahore in 1986) who also owns one of such manufacturing plants, and has served one term as the President Lahore Chamber of Commerce and Industry (LCCI). I am afraid I do not have his direct numbers any more, but if you are really interested, you should be able to get his contacts through LCCI web site and verify the information I provided.``
If the company is worthwhile they would have found customers. Do not give me the BS about not being able to export to India.
````It is you who insists on the virtues of Taliban rule in Afghanistan. If they were so good impose on Pakistani public what was imposed in Afghanistan````
`` OK you request for Iraq like invasion on USA, Australia and India for killing hundreds of thousand of their own people and I will request for Taliban like rule in Pakistan...now this is tit for tat like response and not wish to pursue this sort of discussion, which is not meant for creativeness or knowledge. ``
Pakistani generals who created, financed and equipped the Taliban are capable of imposing Taliban rule on Pakistan. You do not any external help for this. There are plenty of Pakistanis on the chowk which could cheer.
I can request a Iraq style invasion of USA or India or Australia. I just do not know any of any entity that could accomplish it !!!
````Name the company. You conveniently dodged the question twice. ````
`` There are many companies manufacturing and exporting auto components including those for Suzuki in Pakistan. The workshop (1996) I referred to was also attended by many companies, and I do not remember names of the companies exporting those components as that was not the primary motive for me as an organizer and a moderator. Nevertheless, the person who revealed this information in the workshop was, to the best of my memory, Almas Haider (I recall his name because we played tennis once together in Lahore in 1986) who also owns one of such manufacturing plants, and has served one term as the President Lahore Chamber of Commerce and Industry (LCCI). I am afraid I do not have his direct numbers any more, but if you are really interested, you should be able to get his contacts through LCCI web site and verify the information I provided.``
If the company is worthwhile they would have found customers. Do not give me the BS about not being able to export to India.
````It is you who insists on the virtues of Taliban rule in Afghanistan. If they were so good impose on Pakistani public what was imposed in Afghanistan````
`` OK you request for Iraq like invasion on USA, Australia and India for killing hundreds of thousand of their own people and I will request for Taliban like rule in Pakistan...now this is tit for tat like response and not wish to pursue this sort of discussion, which is not meant for creativeness or knowledge. ``
Pakistani generals who created, financed and equipped the Taliban are capable of imposing Taliban rule on Pakistan. You do not any external help for this. There are plenty of Pakistanis on the chowk which could cheer.
I can request a Iraq style invasion of USA or India or Australia. I just do not know any of any entity that could accomplish it !!!
#41 Posted by cayenne on July 19, 2005 12:00:23 pm
A couple of things i find really absurd on this board.One comment about Maruti buying from Pak Suzuki.Last year(foggedabout this year) Maruti manufactured half a million cars for domestic consumption in India alone.Pak Suzuki manufactured 29,500 cars.That`s it.Who should be buying from whom??.Also, about India`s relations with Iran.They have always been excellent and will continue.India`s petroleum reserves are maintained by , surprise!!, the Saudis and crude oil is supplied on a priority basis by the Iranians!!.Now, indian oil companies have gone across the oceans to Ecuador and Venezuela and actually bought oilfields to operate and pump oil for consumption in India.Thanks to hte saudis and the iranians, who supply us at negotiated rates, our oil companies have amassed huge currency reserves to branch out on their own.The IOC, the Indian Oil Corporation is the largest oil company in Asia, bar none.
#40 Posted by arjun_m on July 19, 2005 3:35:25 am
#39 by sifzal on July 19, 2005 1:53am PT
I do not remember names of the companies exporting those components
mmmkay...just like you don`t remember the names of the paki army generals who were prosecuted for the genocide in 71....
Name one Pakistani company that can hold it`s own in the world..an equivalent to Infosys or Wipro...or reliance or Moser-Baer....
I do not remember names of the companies exporting those components
mmmkay...just like you don`t remember the names of the paki army generals who were prosecuted for the genocide in 71....
Name one Pakistani company that can hold it`s own in the world..an equivalent to Infosys or Wipro...or reliance or Moser-Baer....
#39 Posted by sifzal on July 19, 2005 1:53:21 am
#38
``Name the company. You conveniently dodged the question twice. ``
There are many companies manufacturing and exporting auto components including those for Suzuki in Pakistan. The workshop (1996) I referred to was also attended by many companies, and I do not remember names of the companies exporting those components as that was not the primary motive for me as an organizer and a moderator. Nevertheless, the person who revealed this information in the workshop was, to the best of my memory, Almas Haider (I recall his name because we played tennis once together in Lahore in 1986) who also owns one of such manufacturing plants, and has served one term as the President Lahore Chamber of Commerce and Industry (LCCI). I am afraid I do not have his direct numbers any more, but if you are really interested, you should be able to get his contacts through LCCI web site and verify the information I provided.
``It is you who insists on the virtues of Taliban rule in Afghanistan. If they were so good impose on Pakistani public what was imposed in Afghanistan``
OK you request for Iraq like invasion on USA, Australia and India for killing hundreds of thousand of their own people and I will request for Taliban like rule in Pakistan...now this is tit for tat like response and not wish to pursue this sort of discussion, which is not meant for creativeness or knowledge.
``Name the company. You conveniently dodged the question twice. ``
There are many companies manufacturing and exporting auto components including those for Suzuki in Pakistan. The workshop (1996) I referred to was also attended by many companies, and I do not remember names of the companies exporting those components as that was not the primary motive for me as an organizer and a moderator. Nevertheless, the person who revealed this information in the workshop was, to the best of my memory, Almas Haider (I recall his name because we played tennis once together in Lahore in 1986) who also owns one of such manufacturing plants, and has served one term as the President Lahore Chamber of Commerce and Industry (LCCI). I am afraid I do not have his direct numbers any more, but if you are really interested, you should be able to get his contacts through LCCI web site and verify the information I provided.
``It is you who insists on the virtues of Taliban rule in Afghanistan. If they were so good impose on Pakistani public what was imposed in Afghanistan``
OK you request for Iraq like invasion on USA, Australia and India for killing hundreds of thousand of their own people and I will request for Taliban like rule in Pakistan...now this is tit for tat like response and not wish to pursue this sort of discussion, which is not meant for creativeness or knowledge.
#38 Posted by bbabu on July 18, 2005 1:46:53 pm
sifzal #35
`` I dont know how you have come to this conclusion...but I find it fruitless to continue with you on this issue... ``
It is you who insists on the virtues of Taliban rule in Afghanistan. If they were so good impose on Pakistani public what was imposed in Afghanistan.
````Why don`t name this Pakistani company that manufactured Suzuki components and spare us all this crap. If they were so good they would have found other buyer````
`` Pakistan exported those components to Kporea...it is on record for your information. ``
Name the company. You conveniently dodged the question twice.
````Your statement that ``Pakistan managed them pretty well`` reflects your opinion. It pretty much sums your credibility.````
`` I know its a waste of time...so it over and all from myside...take care and good bye! ``
If you think Pakistan managed the post 1990 transition in Afghanistan well it is your opinion. You are entitled to it. Do not expect everyone to agree with you.
`` I dont know how you have come to this conclusion...but I find it fruitless to continue with you on this issue... ``
It is you who insists on the virtues of Taliban rule in Afghanistan. If they were so good impose on Pakistani public what was imposed in Afghanistan.
````Why don`t name this Pakistani company that manufactured Suzuki components and spare us all this crap. If they were so good they would have found other buyer````
`` Pakistan exported those components to Kporea...it is on record for your information. ``
Name the company. You conveniently dodged the question twice.
````Your statement that ``Pakistan managed them pretty well`` reflects your opinion. It pretty much sums your credibility.````
`` I know its a waste of time...so it over and all from myside...take care and good bye! ``
If you think Pakistan managed the post 1990 transition in Afghanistan well it is your opinion. You are entitled to it. Do not expect everyone to agree with you.
#37 Posted by Mike_Hunt on July 18, 2005 8:30:22 am
Who tarnished the image of Pakiland?
Elementary.
The Coffee Peddling Witch, The Cutting & Pasting Obese Hag, The Mad Mullah of Chowk, and the Hippo.
Elementary.
The Coffee Peddling Witch, The Cutting & Pasting Obese Hag, The Mad Mullah of Chowk, and the Hippo.
#36 Posted by ballukhan on July 18, 2005 5:50:27 am
Who is tarnishing the image??? It is the tolerance to these mullahs..........it is the tolerance to terrorism and bigotry in your own house that is causing all this......for now let them say welcome to the new Talibanized regime in NWFP before any one raises this question again.
‘Hasba bill to isolate MMA’
By Raja Asghar
ISLAMABAD, July 9: The NWFP government’s plan to enact a new law to create religious watchdogs has rung alarm bells in the country, some critics seeing it as a move by the Muttahida Majlis-i-Amal (MMA) government to Talibanise the sensitive region.
While the MMA government was due to introduce the controversial Hasbah Bill in the provincial assembly on Monday, the move was denounced by almost all other major political parties and human rights groups in the country.
But the MMA, which says it only seeks to reform society in line with Islamic teachings, seemed set to get the bill passed by its comfortable majority in the 124-seat house.
Designed to create religious mohtasibs, or ombudsmen, at the provincial, district and tehsil levels who will be helped by a virtual religious police in what will be known as “amar bil maroof wa nahi anil munkar” (promotion of virtue and prevention of evil) department, the bill is likely to further strain the provincial government’s relations with the federal government, political sources said.
‘Hasba bill to isolate MMA’
By Raja Asghar
ISLAMABAD, July 9: The NWFP government’s plan to enact a new law to create religious watchdogs has rung alarm bells in the country, some critics seeing it as a move by the Muttahida Majlis-i-Amal (MMA) government to Talibanise the sensitive region.
While the MMA government was due to introduce the controversial Hasbah Bill in the provincial assembly on Monday, the move was denounced by almost all other major political parties and human rights groups in the country.
But the MMA, which says it only seeks to reform society in line with Islamic teachings, seemed set to get the bill passed by its comfortable majority in the 124-seat house.
Designed to create religious mohtasibs, or ombudsmen, at the provincial, district and tehsil levels who will be helped by a virtual religious police in what will be known as “amar bil maroof wa nahi anil munkar” (promotion of virtue and prevention of evil) department, the bill is likely to further strain the provincial government’s relations with the federal government, political sources said.
#35 Posted by sifzal on July 18, 2005 5:27:53 am
#32
``All of us have biases. But I can correct myself when I am wrong. You are blinded to your distorted version of reality.``
I dont know how you have come to this conclusion...but I find it fruitless to continue with you on this issue...
``Why don`t name this Pakistani company that manufactured Suzuki components and spare us all this crap. If they were so good they would have found other buyer``
Pakistan exported those components to Kporea...it is on record for your information.
``To say Afghanistan`s environment is polluted because of US bombing is laughable. ``
Then keep laughing ... I am disappointed in myself for my earlier estimation of your intelligence.
``Your statement that ``Pakistan managed them pretty well`` reflects your opinion. It pretty much sums your credibility.``
I know its a waste of time...so it over and all from myside...take care and good bye!
``All of us have biases. But I can correct myself when I am wrong. You are blinded to your distorted version of reality.``
I dont know how you have come to this conclusion...but I find it fruitless to continue with you on this issue...
``Why don`t name this Pakistani company that manufactured Suzuki components and spare us all this crap. If they were so good they would have found other buyer``
Pakistan exported those components to Kporea...it is on record for your information.
``To say Afghanistan`s environment is polluted because of US bombing is laughable. ``
Then keep laughing ... I am disappointed in myself for my earlier estimation of your intelligence.
``Your statement that ``Pakistan managed them pretty well`` reflects your opinion. It pretty much sums your credibility.``
I know its a waste of time...so it over and all from myside...take care and good bye!
#34 Posted by ajeya on July 17, 2005 7:22:57 pm
#30 by ahmedmadani
[Re: # 15 Mr Arjun M ..You are so happy that this will tarnish good name of pakistan and paksistani people. ]
WHAT good name?
[Re: # 15 Mr Arjun M ..You are so happy that this will tarnish good name of pakistan and paksistani people. ]
WHAT good name?
#33 Posted by ZahraJ on July 17, 2005 7:22:33 pm
The image is indeed ``tarnished``. There are no signs of recovery in the near future as well.
[This country could have done so much better with a better leader. Politicians everywhere are corrupt, but they still have national interests. Unfortunately our leaders have always belonged to the army or of a feudal background. Either way, common man always suffers. We know however who actually tarnished the image of Pakistan.]
There was something in this article that made me visit it twice. Chowk is posting jargon right and left but there was something here that needed attention. Pakistanis will never be happy with any home grown leader. If there`s a maulvi in picture then the masses will desire a liberal. If there`s a liberal in power then they will wish for a conservative. If he/she is a balanced individual then they will seek for irrational and unbalanced creation of God. Unfortunately, there is no perfect answer. People will never be completely happy and content.
For the leaders (good or bad), there is also very little return on investment. Their lives are at stake all the time. Historically, none of the Pakistani leaders have had a decent end to their tenure. Theyve had a miserable end and added to the misery of the masses. Well, they have certainly attracted enough attention to further tarnish the image of Pakistan. With that said, probably the leadership position needs to be outsourced.
[This country could have done so much better with a better leader. Politicians everywhere are corrupt, but they still have national interests. Unfortunately our leaders have always belonged to the army or of a feudal background. Either way, common man always suffers. We know however who actually tarnished the image of Pakistan.]
There was something in this article that made me visit it twice. Chowk is posting jargon right and left but there was something here that needed attention. Pakistanis will never be happy with any home grown leader. If there`s a maulvi in picture then the masses will desire a liberal. If there`s a liberal in power then they will wish for a conservative. If he/she is a balanced individual then they will seek for irrational and unbalanced creation of God. Unfortunately, there is no perfect answer. People will never be completely happy and content.
For the leaders (good or bad), there is also very little return on investment. Their lives are at stake all the time. Historically, none of the Pakistani leaders have had a decent end to their tenure. Theyve had a miserable end and added to the misery of the masses. Well, they have certainly attracted enough attention to further tarnish the image of Pakistan. With that said, probably the leadership position needs to be outsourced.
#32 Posted by bbabu on July 17, 2005 5:07:35 pm
sifzal #31
`` You are in love with your country (and I understand that) so you have to side with them and see Pakistani media through Indian or ``Western`` media eyes.... The issue is that till you get out of that framework, I can’t make you see the realities... ``
All of us have biases. But I can correct myself when I am wrong. You are blinded to your distorted version of reality.
`` In 1996 American Secretary of commerce and industry addressing a workshop organized by us said, Pakistan’s soil for fruits especially Sahiwal is better than Florida’s country soil...the potential of FDI in the engineering industry is great too...but the problem is media, honestly your government should take CNN and BBC by the horns those have distorted the image. Till it does so, people’s image about Pakistan will not change, and a single person like me who knows the truth can’t do anything...`` (Indian media now has joined the two medias, if not surpassed them). It was the same workshop where we were informed that Indian Suzuki (you call it maruti) wanted to import from Pakistan some Suzuki parts as Pakistani manufactured were of very good quality parts and would have costed them cheaper than importing from Japan or Korea, but Indra Ghandi warned the MD in person that she would rather see the factory closed for which even a nut & bolt is to be imported from Pakistan. You can verify it from your suzuki/maruti owner. With such feelings at the top, Indian media needs to follow the same, and Indian public can never appreciate the other side...I don`t know how much to share with you my experiences...but once you have step out of your shell I know you will be able to find a lot more... ``
Your example on Maruti is exactly an illustration of your biases.
Indira Gandhi is elected Prime Minister of India. Maruti used to be owned 50% by the Indian government. She has the right to tell the Maruti MD what to do. I prefer she did concentrated on other things rather than telling Maruti MD what to do. Why should Indira Gandhi do business with Pakistani companies when Gen Zia was arming Khalistanis.
Why don`t name this Pakistani company that manufactured Suzuki components and spare us all this crap. If they were so good they would have found other buyers.
``what environmental degradation ?? ``
`` I don’t know what to say...it so much of ignorance in this sentence, but I understand again as everyone need not to be aware of every thing. The amount of bombs fired were the highest since the Second World War...more than they fired even in Iraq or else where... ``
To say Afghanistan`s environment is polluted because of US bombing is laughable.
`` Ignoring the use of adjective by you here is the fact from my point of view...A generation which is born under the soviets invasion followed by the guerilla war over a period of 22 years, should not be expected to be reasonable like those living in peaceful environment from the day one of coming into power or even in next 5 years...the world ignored them and even US left the after getting its mission completed of Soviet defeat. Pakistan was left alone to deal with the generation that knew nothing but war and was fully equipped by weapons provided by the US. This new generation was a different breed and I would say that Pakistan managed them pretty well during their initial phase, and before things could be brought to better, it was forced by US to change its stance. The ``ethnic bitterness`` you mentioned, should be blamed on first to the soviets and the world at large before putting on Talibans who put all sorts of embargos on them. ``
Your statement that ``Pakistan managed them pretty well`` reflects your opinion. It pretty much sums your credibility.
`` You are in love with your country (and I understand that) so you have to side with them and see Pakistani media through Indian or ``Western`` media eyes.... The issue is that till you get out of that framework, I can’t make you see the realities... ``
All of us have biases. But I can correct myself when I am wrong. You are blinded to your distorted version of reality.
`` In 1996 American Secretary of commerce and industry addressing a workshop organized by us said, Pakistan’s soil for fruits especially Sahiwal is better than Florida’s country soil...the potential of FDI in the engineering industry is great too...but the problem is media, honestly your government should take CNN and BBC by the horns those have distorted the image. Till it does so, people’s image about Pakistan will not change, and a single person like me who knows the truth can’t do anything...`` (Indian media now has joined the two medias, if not surpassed them). It was the same workshop where we were informed that Indian Suzuki (you call it maruti) wanted to import from Pakistan some Suzuki parts as Pakistani manufactured were of very good quality parts and would have costed them cheaper than importing from Japan or Korea, but Indra Ghandi warned the MD in person that she would rather see the factory closed for which even a nut & bolt is to be imported from Pakistan. You can verify it from your suzuki/maruti owner. With such feelings at the top, Indian media needs to follow the same, and Indian public can never appreciate the other side...I don`t know how much to share with you my experiences...but once you have step out of your shell I know you will be able to find a lot more... ``
Your example on Maruti is exactly an illustration of your biases.
Indira Gandhi is elected Prime Minister of India. Maruti used to be owned 50% by the Indian government. She has the right to tell the Maruti MD what to do. I prefer she did concentrated on other things rather than telling Maruti MD what to do. Why should Indira Gandhi do business with Pakistani companies when Gen Zia was arming Khalistanis.
Why don`t name this Pakistani company that manufactured Suzuki components and spare us all this crap. If they were so good they would have found other buyers.
``what environmental degradation ?? ``
`` I don’t know what to say...it so much of ignorance in this sentence, but I understand again as everyone need not to be aware of every thing. The amount of bombs fired were the highest since the Second World War...more than they fired even in Iraq or else where... ``
To say Afghanistan`s environment is polluted because of US bombing is laughable.
`` Ignoring the use of adjective by you here is the fact from my point of view...A generation which is born under the soviets invasion followed by the guerilla war over a period of 22 years, should not be expected to be reasonable like those living in peaceful environment from the day one of coming into power or even in next 5 years...the world ignored them and even US left the after getting its mission completed of Soviet defeat. Pakistan was left alone to deal with the generation that knew nothing but war and was fully equipped by weapons provided by the US. This new generation was a different breed and I would say that Pakistan managed them pretty well during their initial phase, and before things could be brought to better, it was forced by US to change its stance. The ``ethnic bitterness`` you mentioned, should be blamed on first to the soviets and the world at large before putting on Talibans who put all sorts of embargos on them. ``
Your statement that ``Pakistan managed them pretty well`` reflects your opinion. It pretty much sums your credibility.
#31 Posted by sifzal on July 17, 2005 5:35:38 am
Re: # 28
``The problem with the some in the biased Pakistani media is that they violate every single facet of journalist ethics. To be fair there is a good share of those in India. The problem is not with American journalists. The real problem in USA is the attention span of the public. Corporate ownership of media is a limited issue. ``
You are in love with your country (and I understand that) so you have to side with them and see Pakistani media through Indian or ``Western`` media eyes.... The issue is that till you get out of that framework, I can’t make you see the realities...
In 1996 American Secretary of commerce and industry addressing a workshop organized by us said, Pakistan’s soil for fruits especially Sahiwal is better than Florida’s country soil...the potential of FDI in the engineering industry is great too...but the problem is media, honestly your government should take CNN and BBC by the horns those have distorted the image. Till it does so, people’s image about Pakistan will not change, and a single person like me who knows the truth can’t do anything...`` (Indian media now has joined the two medias, if not surpassed them). It was the same workshop where we were informed that Indian Suzuki (you call it maruti) wanted to import from Pakistan some Suzuki parts as Pakistani manufactured were of very good quality parts and would have costed them cheaper than importing from Japan or Korea, but Indra Ghandi warned the MD in person that she would rather see the factory closed for which even a nut & bolt is to be imported from Pakistan. You can verify it from your suzuki/maruti owner. With such feelings at the top, Indian media needs to follow the same, and Indian public can never appreciate the other side...I don`t know how much to share with you my experiences...but once you have step out of your shell I know you will be able to find a lot more...
``what environmental degradation ?? ``
I don’t know what to say...it so much of ignorance in this sentence, but I understand again as everyone need not to be aware of every thing. The amount of bombs fired were the highest since the Second World War...more than they fired even in Iraq or else where...
``Your support of the Taliban based on common crime statistics is pathetic. Stalin`s Russia was safe from crime too. The Taliban is largely responsible for ethnic bitterness between Pusthuns and Tajiks, Hazaras etc. May be that is why Pakistanis are so fond of it.``
Ignoring the use of adjective by you here is the fact from my point of view...A generation which is born under the soviets invasion followed by the guerilla war over a period of 22 years, should not be expected to be reasonable like those living in peaceful environment from the day one of coming into power or even in next 5 years...the world ignored them and even US left the after getting its mission completed of Soviet defeat. Pakistan was left alone to deal with the generation that knew nothing but war and was fully equipped by weapons provided by the US. This new generation was a different breed and I would say that Pakistan managed them pretty well during their initial phase, and before things could be brought to better, it was forced by US to change its stance. The ``ethnic bitterness`` you mentioned, should be blamed on first to the soviets and the world at large before putting on Talibans who put all sorts of embargos on them.
``India does not have a border with Afghanistan. India had poor relations with Iran in 1979. I do not think they could do anything to stop the Soviets.``
#30 Posted by ahmedmadani on July 16, 2005 10:58:25 am
Re: # 15 Mr Arjun M ..you seems extremely happy due this English terror problem.
You enjoy miseries. You are so happy that this will tarnish good name of pakistan and paksistani people. You should have sad for loss of life but you are having time of your life. Pakistanis are very sad ok. These are ENGLISH not pakistanise so is English problem ot Pakistani problem.
You are recist. The English court majistrate has declared ``Paki`` as detogatory word and person uttering such bad stuff can be prosecuted in England.
For your knowledge refer us as ``Pakistanies `` not pakis as you refer all time. Also refer as Pakistan or Islamic republics of Pakistan and not as ``Pakiland``.
I do not think you are going follow my suggestion.
Anyway you have time of life so please enjoy all time at others miseries.
I never refer Indoa/Bharat as Land of Kafirs or as some refer to India as bunch of chicken headed Kufrstan as we as decent, modest and cultured.
You enjoy miseries. You are so happy that this will tarnish good name of pakistan and paksistani people. You should have sad for loss of life but you are having time of your life. Pakistanis are very sad ok. These are ENGLISH not pakistanise so is English problem ot Pakistani problem.
You are recist. The English court majistrate has declared ``Paki`` as detogatory word and person uttering such bad stuff can be prosecuted in England.
For your knowledge refer us as ``Pakistanies `` not pakis as you refer all time. Also refer as Pakistan or Islamic republics of Pakistan and not as ``Pakiland``.
I do not think you are going follow my suggestion.
Anyway you have time of life so please enjoy all time at others miseries.
I never refer Indoa/Bharat as Land of Kafirs or as some refer to India as bunch of chicken headed Kufrstan as we as decent, modest and cultured.
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