Project Mumbai Makeover: Casualties of Development

#63 by jang on July 12, 2005 8:23am PT


e.g. a person in dharavi wants to be close to his/her work and hence wont go to mankhurd, where affordable housing is buit because the commute is slow. now, mankhurd should be no more than 10 minutes from dharavi on a good commuter system.


And the commute on the harbor line is slow because of the encroachments around the tracks...catch-22...

#57 by JagdeeshGodbole on July 12, 2005 7:42am PT


Let me tell you as a fellow maharashtrian and a sometimes Mumbaikar that the life-style of the middle class and the elites is largely supported by the poor who live in slums.


And that means what? The ``poor`` people should be allowed to set up a slum on occupied land near the airport?

Kunal wrote:
`` Remember, a few people are rich because many are poor. ``

This is absolute falsehood. Only a few people are rich, because the feel-good commies
will not allow others to get rich.
A neigborhood shopkeeper or a truck owner has to bribe cops to transport goods across
state lines so as to avoid high taxes. A person owning a small apt will not rent it out
because of rent-control. Mumbai govt wont allow sick mills to be shut down and land
sold to others. Some people may lose jobs - but many many more will gain jobs.

Govt doles out subsidies to entrenched labor and farmer interests (free water, electricity)
etc and takes out loans. All Govt revenue is tied up in paying interest rather than
investing in roads and infrastructure. All in the name ``helping poor`` ....
If there is a decent road and property rights, a poor man can atleast have ownership
to own a small beedi shop and hire one helping hand.

It is the self appointed, feel good, beleeding hearts - who have kept India poor.

Look at Gujarat - what a economically vibrant state it is - even though it is almost
a desert, look at how it is growing. Gujaratis are some of the most philanthropic as well.

Infact, Gujarat now needs to import labor from other states !!
Gujarat Govt, ran ads in the major newspapers - asking companies to shift from Mumbai
to Gujarat. If the Maharashtra govt remains incompetent - Industries and any decent
businessman will flee to states with better investment environment.

People become rich - by hardwork and initiative and taking risk as entrepeneurs.
(Some familites may have inheritance - but most business people who are well to do
are so because of their initiative and hard work ).
Let us see you put your own money on any project and see how risky it is ...then
talk.

JG true dat..all the fancy restaurants and bars are manned by bhaiyyas from slums (actually low-cost housing). given the fact that there is a large working class in slums who pays thru their nose for essentials to Dadas, there got to be a market-based solution rather than encroachment. these urban workers are willing to pay for water, electricity etc..so govt should focus on general development of infrastructure, fast commuting routes etc and not tolerate random sprawl which benefits only the dadas and political operators.

e.g. a person in dharavi wants to be close to his/her work and hence wont go to mankhurd, where affordable housing is buit because the commute is slow. now, mankhurd should be no more than 10 minutes from dharavi on a good commuter system.

mumbai municipality one of the richest in revenues, its just intellectual lazyness of the left which makes the place dirty and bad for its urban worker.

Mohar 11,

I don`t think you got Jagdeesh`s point. And to care for poor people certainly does not mean you deprive them of their basic rights such as food and housing. Remember, a few people are rich because many are poor. Only midle classes can think of the `gardners and dabbawallas`` as filth. They work as hard, or more than a software professional. One shoudn`t be patronizing to them and think of uplifting these ``filthy`` (your term) people, but one needs to be aware and respect their labor and fight for their rights.

What I have found, is that such left-right ideological debates are useless. Once you start talking about real issues the distance between the two sides is less than it seems.

For instance, Kunal can you tell you about what solution do you envisage for the expansion of Mumbai airport where 200 acres of airport land is occupied by slums.

Re: # 57 jag
//...Where else do you think your maids, gardners, dubbawalas etc come from?...//

And you want to keep them that way? Is that your plan for the poor - ``the poor are giving me ``services``, so let`s have all the slums and filth`` - is that how commie logic works these days?

Economic growth is what is necessary to lift quality of life for everybody - the growth will come from more business, more empolyment opportunities, more money. It can`t happen if Mumbai is choking with slums and filth. It can`t happen if the airport terminals are choked, roads are choked, infrastructure is crumbling. Airport, roads, infrastructure are not luxury items that the so called middle class wants - these are items that is needed for the growth, the growth for everybody 0 for poor, for rich, for middle class.

Jeez - how many years more is going to take for fools like you to understand this very basic ideas? 57 years of filth, poverty and deprivation - people are still giving ``services of the gardner`` as an excuse to keep things the way they are.

Un-f***ing-believable!!!!

Cayenne says,

>>> I doubt it.No indian can stoop so low.

That`s not true. You are a good example of how low the Indians can stoop! :-) :-)

Thank you jagdeesh. If not for human rights and equality, the mindless middle class and upper class in Mumbai should realize that they are dependent on the services of poor.

Re: # 53
Let me tell you as a fellow maharashtrian and a sometimes Mumbaikar that the life-style of the middle class and the elites is largely supported by the poor who live in slums.

Where else do you think your maids, gardners, dubbawalas etc come from?

#46

the saying is by Churchill and it goes something like this:

``If you are 20 and not a liberal you have no heart
If you are 40 and not a conservative you have no brains``

Re: # 44

Stop this non sense.
Even the poor who live in slums of Mumbai have T.V. , V.C.D. Players and Refrigerators, even Free Light and Rationed food at discounted prices, they dont pay taxes and litter on the sreets and still complaint as being wronged...
As far as you are concered you must be from rich class with hollow sympathy for ``poor`` and if u feeelll for them then rather indulging in debates go and help those Poooorrrr

Ref Dalit $44

[...barely 10 per cent of all households have life insurance cover]

Why do you need life insurance in India if you are poor?

For every person who died in the tsunami, their families got Rs. 200,000 - Rs. 100,000 from the Prime Minister`s Relief Fund and another Rs. 100,000 from Puratchi Thalaivi Amma the Chief Minister of Tamil Nadu. Nobody paid insurance premia but they got death benefits! Why do you want to enrich the capitalist insurance companies by asking that people should buy insurance?

Are you an insurance salesman?

This is the height of foolishiness. The slums are mostly of those who are burden and have come from poor states like Bihar, U.P. and even Bangla desh.
Maharashtra gives country Rs. 50,000 crore annualy, the biigest and in retrun maharashtra gets is slums from other states.So remember if Maharashtra crumbles then whole country will be poor.
And this kind AirCondition class ``poor sympathy`` should be stopped (the biggest actor in this sense is Shabana Aaazmi Madam) ,
and should be replaced by giving those poor chance to live in your A.C. and velvett bed(haa ...haaa)
We want all those who are burden to either pay for the loss or get out and help their own state, that will help their own state.
And dear Shivali stop shedding Crocodile Tears.

Re: # 49

I doubt it.No indian can stoop so low.Paks are all sweetness and light in front of your face, but when they wanna be vicious they have it down to a fine art.And, the way pakland has been functioning lately, they must be all eaten up inside that they have to buy our produce to shore up prices and inflation, our diesel, depend on our cables as back up, need the US$800 million or so that we can pay them for the gas pipeline from Iran, take heed of our warnings about the recent starting up of terrorist camps(and having to take action on it)....i could go on and on.They are bitter and eaten up about all this.

#42 by kunal on July 11, 2005 4:54pm PT


And yeah, just check the achievements of Cuba


And what achievements would those be?