South Asia’s Clarence Darrow

another thing in those blasts only the bombay muslims were involved right after the riots, there is no doubt babri caused angst for muslims all over and it probably exacerbated the over all feeling, but if it had been babri muslims from other places would be expected to take part. but it being the work of only bombay muslims, right after the riots, in the targets i have mentioned points in the direction of the riots.

Re: # 196
You want to create more myths ...........perhaps you know better in your situation about the ``actual reasons`` for the blasts....................may be you can throw some light on 9/11 as well..............but first you must read the Sri Krishna report in order to understand some of the facts....................

http://www.dalitstan.org/mughalstan/qatl/krishna/kri1_6.html
As a result of the demolition of Babri Masjid and the riots which took place in Bombay during December 1992 and January 1993, there was communal cleavage in Bombay. The Muslims felt a feeling of insecurity, tension and anger on account of their sufferings during the two riot periods and they were inclined to blame the State Government and police for their misery. The Muslims perhaps felt that the Government and police, instead protecting their interests, had actually acted against their interests by joining hands with communal elements which took a lead in the riots. A large number of Muslim youths came to entertain this firm belief. This body of angry young men was exploited by anti-national elements, who were desirous of de-stabilizing the situation in this country. Certain anti-national elements aided and abetted by ISI of Pakistan recruited some of the angry young men by brainwashing them that they should take revenge for the humiliation and misery heaped upon them. A grand conspiracy was hatched at the instance of the notorious smuggler, Dawood Ibrahim Kaskar, operating from Dubai, to recruit and train young Muslims to vent their anger and wreak revenge by exploding bombs near vital installations and also in Hindu dominated areas so as to engineer a fresh bout of communal riots. iii) Pursuant to this conspiracy certain brainwashed muslim youngsters were recruited and taken to Pakistan for intensive training in the handling of sophisticated weapons and explosives. As a part of this conspiracy Dawood Ibrahim and smugglers like Mohd. Dossa, aided and abetted by several criminal or similar elements in Bombay, smuggled large consignments of AK-56 rifles, hand grenades, and sophisticated explosives known as RDX. Some of these were landed clandestinely on the coast of Raigad District and some on the Coast of Gujarat State. These were then clandestinely transported to be stored at convenient places within and outside Bombay, awaiting the signal for their use.
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Re: # 198

Addressed to Ballu...

sorry the blasts took place even much later in mid march

BTW your chutiyapa is quite visible in the way you have argued that Musharraf and Aziz were on the list... Yes- Miandad invited them.... you can invite President Bush to your child`s ceremony... does it mean anything...

This is the extent of your argument ever and always... you are ready to discredit people like Hindvi who are the most secular and patriotic of Indians and the most logical defence against Pakistani arguments... you deny history when you deny that the role of the Congress in partition and you just make an utter fool of yourself in trying to explain why a man hailed for 3 decades as the best ambassador of Hindu Muslim unity turned out to be a separatist... You are merely the level of Urstruly or Malik99... their Indian equivalent... intolerant, bigoted, idiotic and without logical arguments...

The only expose that we can see is that of your butting in and diverting my attention when I was analysing Hindvi`s assertions on this board..............................

pal the bomb blasts actually were executed by the Memons, and they lived in bombay, they were seeing day in and day out what was happening in the riots babri was broken in th first week of dec, riots took place in two waves in dec and then in jan, the blasts took place well after, around mid feb. if the blasts took place in response to babri they wouldnt have taken place in bombay, and they would have targetted hindu religous places not police stations, shiv sena offices, govt offices, stock exchange and other public buildings.

Re: # 191

The only mythology in the history of subcontinent is Gandhi and his ``Secularism``. I am not redefining anything. I can see why my articles piss you off in such a manner. You have exposed yourself well in the way you have dealt with Hindvi here...

I don`t about NHK, found his knowledge of history quite lacking but both Hamidm and Tahmed have repeatedly said that Pakistan`s creation was justified and that they support Jinnah`s idea of Pakistan... Infact it was hilarious how Hamidm had the same Indians-like you who profess their love for him- abusing him when he took on Gandhi a few months ago.

Re: # 190

To think that Dawood was bombing innocents in mumbai as a retributive justice for the riot victims is a laughable theory?? Read this interview of Chotta Shakeel carefully...............he says that the bomb blasts were in retaliation of Babri Masjid...................these are mad criminals who hide their actual intents....it is much possible that some bombay brokers forgot to pay him hafta........ask OBL why 9/11 happened........he will tell you some c0ck and bull story................

http://www.frontlineonnet.com/fl1607/16070450.htm

``You criticise Chhota Rajan, saying that he is killing innocent people, but surely you are doing the same thing. How do you justify that?

As I just explained to you, this whole situation has been forced upon us. Look, after the Babri Masjid was ``martyred``, or broken, as you might say in your language, some Muslims responded by carrying out the serial blasts in Mumbai. They were infuriated because their religious sentiments were hurt. Jiske dil mein mazhab ki aag nahin jalti woh insaan hi nahin hai (someone who does not have the fire of religion burning in his heart is not human at all). But anyway, whatever happened happened. If you hurt someone`s religious sentiments, there will be a retaliation. So, after the Babri Masjid was martyred, the serial blasts took place. That was the end of the matter, and everybody accepted it. But now, by killing innocent people, Chhota Rajan has started the whole battle again. ``

I understand Gandhi`s motivations too, there was no way the debating society that was the congress was going to lead India to freedom he also understood violence would not work plus he seemed to be genuinely religous i.e. he genuinely believed in the religous ideal of the ascetic/ the hindu and sufi ideal of one who conquers his self/nafs. The fact that this helped in mobilising the masses in such a powerful way reinforced his faith in the power of saintlines and self sacrifice and he used it for political purposes.

Given the structure of indian society in which religous or non temporal symbolism worked in such a powerful way which Gandhi had made evident and thereby changed the ground rules of politics with his support of conservative forces withen the muslim political pretenders meant that secular, liberal Jinnah sensed that he wasnt going to get anwhere personally or politically in a country in which muslim would vote only for muslim and hindu for hindu. offcourse the british had helped make it that way with their stated policy of Divide Et Imperium.

Are you feigning ignorance?? The valima had the best of the Pakistan on its guest list including Mush...................


http://news.indiainfo.com/2005/08/05/0508dawood.html

Karachi: Pakistani President Pervez Musharraf and Prime Minister Shaukat Aziz stayed away from the strictly guarded `Valima` of underworld don Dawood Ibrahim`s daughter Mahrukh here.
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former test cricketers and sports icons, ex-cricket board officials, a large contingent of the media, prominent businessmen, retired Government and Civil Servants and celebrities from the showbiz gathered to bless the newly-wed couple who made their appearance at 11.00 pm, almost 90 minutes behind schedule.

Junaid was smartly dressed in a dark blue evening suit while Mahrukh wore an elegant and graceful golden sharara with lots of jewellery.

It may be mentioned here that according to Islamic tradition, the Valima dresses of the bride and the groom are prepared by their respective in-laws.

The electronic media was kept away from the hotel premises and mobile phones were not allowed inside the large banquet hall. Only family members and close friends were allowed close to the stage where the couple sat for family movies and photographs.

Nearly half-a-dozen security guards were deployed around the stage to stop trespassers.

Inside the hall, there were nearly 40 security guards who ensured that no one breached the laid-down instructions.

Insiders said CCTV cameras, voice recorders and mobile jammers were also installed in the hall. Prior to the arrival of guests, the hall was thoroughly checked before being cleared for reception and the guests were allowed inside only after thorough security checks.

The dinner with 18 dishes, including Chinese, Continental and Pakistani food besides half a dozen sweet dishes was served in separate dinning rooms for women and men.

``The food was tested and cleared by medical staff before it was served,`` a family member said.

I think YLH you are caught in your own theological trap........... Now I will reveal a secret to you- there can never be a modern Pakistan unless it distances itself from the crap about putting its constitution of the top of some ``Islamic Principles`` (whatever that means)............this religious FOUNDATIONALISM is actually the ``root cause`` of the Hasba Bills that are soon goijng to be promulgate all over the Pakistani provinces..................educated Pakistanis like NHK Saheb, Hamidm or Tahmed and other`s understanding of secularism is much maturer and deeper than your approaching it via Jinnah and through redefining of neo-TNTism..................It would be better if you stop creating mythologies in order to make secularism acceptable in Pakistan ...............


OTH...............Hindvi`s professed admiration for Dawood and in the same breath for Gandhi is laughable............he is clearly another Paki communalist who tries his best not to sound communal but the freudian slip of tongue reveals his intent clearly......................he is again into another myth building spree trying to making communalism sound very intellectual...................

ballukhan
when the state abandons its responsibility and the police, bureaucracy and politicians join in the rapine, murder and mutilation people take help from where ever they get it, the first order of life is survival. Most Indian muslims who are aware of the situation in bombay dont look upon dawood as a villan, they know he was as mcuh an India (including cricket) supporter as the next hindu don until you know what happened. I would support the hindus, or any other minority doing the same if the situations were reversed, it would have been better if he had targetted the shiv sena shakhas, police stations, mobile vans etc. but then beggars cant be choosers.


YLH
i am actually a Nehru admirer, Gandhi was too religous for my tastes. i am not a Jinnah admirer (he shows a character flaw by taking a public position which was completely opposite to his personal one and then abandoning all those constituents who had in their naivette assumed he would negotiate on their behalf) though I understand his motivations.

Re: # 187

The wedding I understand was in Dubai...

Many Indians were in attendance. Since I am not the rich smuggling type nor Indian I wasn`t invited thank god.

BTW is it just me but is Ballu Khan`s style of argument eerie similar to our Islamic fanatics like Urstruly, Malik99 etc who start by character assassination and grouping people and questioning their motives and indeed casting aspersions on their sentiments?

Two different sides of the same coin or perhaps same sides of two different coins... either way...

Welcome YLH, this is your board and you can also join in to redefine Indian nationalism by comparing the virtues of Dawood Ibrahim with those of Gandhi!!
BTW, Were you invited to Dawood`s daughter`s wedding reception? Did you have the honor of going there? Did you find the creme-da-la-creme of Paki intelligensia there? How must all of them felt honoured to fete on the glory of Pakistan`s ``guest`` who could successfully bomb Mumbai- something which even their world class army could never do!!