Will Pakistanis Listen and Act?

Re: # 175

ajeya, is the term ``...chaparasi`` you used to call attention of this guy supposed to be a insult? I saw kane use the word ``bhangi`` to in another thread to insult somebody else.

I would rather use the well accepted insults like ``mullah`` or ``jehadi`` :) If you use the word chaparasi and bhangi to insult somebody, it reeks of feudalism, which I am under the impression that is long dead in India. Please dont insult a profession that tries to make a honest living.

Just my 2-centimos.

Y

re:#161 by Khansaab
You are one of those who have given a bad name to Pakistanis. They are now simply called Pakis, a derogatory term that means ungrateful at best and barbarians at worst. Read the following article to see why Pakis are not trusted any more in UK:
http://www.sulekha.com/news/nhc.aspx?cid=430508
I can`t blame u for your behaviou if you destroyed your brain cells rocking your head in front of that holy book written by a Beodouin many centuries ago.

I am on a visit to India that is finally coming to an end. I see an India that is comfortable with both ancient cultures and modernity. No doubt Bangalore was a disappointment because of its poor infrastructure, poor roads but i saw a silver lining. Women competing as equals with men. Smartly dressed women whiz past me on a mobike or a scooter. These belong to middle income families and are blazing a new trail. Many opportunities have been thrown up to the young generation of Indians due to BPO and IT boom and these people are making use of these opportunities while people like u sit in your madrassas plotting to blow up the world and dream of Islamic resurgence (whatever that means).
I would advise u to open up and see the world around u instead of being trapped in your own shell. You might find a new world around u if u do so, a world so different from the one u are living that u would have hard time believing what u see. Who knows your dying brain cells may even get rejuvenated?
Sridhar

re:#161 by Khansaab
You are one of those who have given a bad name to Pakistanis. They are now simply called Pakis, a derogatory term that means ungrateful at best and barbarians at worst. Read the following article to see why Pakis are not trusted any more in UK:
http://www.sulekha.com/news/nhc.aspx?cid=430508
I can`t blame u for your behaviou if you destroyed your brain cells rocking your head in front of that holy book written by a Beodouin many centuries ago.

I am on a visit to India that is finally coming to an end. I see an India that is comfortable with both ancient cultures and modernity. No doubt Bangalore was a disappointment because of its poor infrastructure, poor roads but i saw a silver lining. Women competing as equals with men. Smartly dressed women whiz past me on a mobike or a scooter. These belong to middle income families and are blazing a new trail. Many opportunities have been thrown up to the young generation of Indians due to BPO and IT boom and these people are making use of these opportunities while people like u sit in your madrassas plotting to blow up the world and dream of Islamic resurgence (whatever that means).
I would advise u to open up and see the world around u instead of being trapped in your own shell. You might find a new world around u if u do so, a world so different from the one u are living that u would have hard time believing what u see. Who knows your dying brain cells may even get rejuvenated?
Sridhar

#161 by KhanChaprasi

[Your arguments are as infantile as a senile child’s whose nerve of farts has been pinched.]

And these imbeciles are allowed to post on Chowk!

It is always suspicious when people add a “saab” to the end of their names by themselves.


[Like you say that, you will cut off four of your own fingers and point them all at us!? How pathetic can you get? ]

O what an imbecile.

[Be that as you may, eat your lily livered heart out, for we shall continue to dominate
despite one or two setbacks here or there]

One or two setbacks….

Hahahahahaha….

Here or there…

Hahahahaha…..

Continue to surrender?

Hahahahaha…….


[as our forefathers did (if you have studied history?), for almost 1200 years when we ruled over you. I speak of people like Mahmud-i- Ghazni, Mohammad Ghori, Alaudin Khilji, Sher Shah Suri, Ahmad Shah Abdali and many more of the ilk. Such were the people who made people like you to “behoove!”. However when I said that we all must behoove, naturally I was only appealing to the sensible people from amongst all of us, not to trivial bigots like you.]

Another descendent of Timur the Lame! No less…..

:-)



[As for you, go on keep throwing your juvenile temper tantrums until you are blue in the face and hoarse in the throat for all the good or bad it would do us all here. It may only make your parents want to put some sense in you.]

“Make my parents”? Huh? What is THAT all about?

Re: # 170 Actually most of these people do have some sort of a roof over their heads but its only just. They live in urban slums.

An article on Pat Robertson’s Christian Broadcasting Network website, which is the only “real” news for the neo-cons

JULY 26, 2005
Is the War on Terror Headed to Pakistan?
http://www.cbn.com/blogs/dalehurd/050726.asp

The London bombing, with its Pakistani connection, has again thrust the spotlight on Islamabad as a dubious, and some would say, double-dealing “partner” in the war on terror. I’ll explain why, in a few paragraphs. First, some interesting background…
For years, a confidential U.S. military source has told me repeatedly what has since become conventional wisdom: Osama bin Laden has been living across the border from Afghanistan in the mountains of Pakistan, and he has eluded capture with the assistance of Pakistan’s military.
His lair is a high altitude location that can be assaulted only by dropping commandoes from aircraft. The rugged terrain and high altitude environment would make such an assault an extremely difficult task. But my source says the biggest factor preventing the nabbing of bin Laden is that it would have to be a secret incursion into Pakistani territory without Pakistan’s knowledge. He says American commanders in Afghanistan know that members of Pakistan’s military pass information to bin Laden.
Consider that when U.S. forces crossed into Pakistan earlier this month and killed 24 terrorists on Pakistani soil, Pakistan did not thank us.
General Pervez Musharraf, Pakistan`s military ruler, reportedly told U.S. Central Command Chief Gen. John Abizaid that “we want our borders to be respected in the war on terrorism and will not put up with future border breaches.``
My source says the Pakistanis are such an unreliable ally that the U.S has resorted to installing its own clandestine network of operatives inside Pakistan in order to nab high value al-Qaeda figures and spirit them out of the country without the Pakistani government’s knowledge (and interference).
So to what degree can we still call Pakistan an ally in the war on terror?
Musharraf told the Financial Times of London Monday that “the command and control system of al-Qaeda in his country has been destroyed, excluding any possibility that the terrorist network could have carried out this month`s bombings in London and Egypt.”
This claim is laughable, and either Musharraf is really that out of touch with reality, or he’s playing a double game in which he hopes to hang on to power by trying please both us and the forces within his military who support bin Laden. I vote for the latter.
The secular Musharraf, in his role as modern version of the last Czar of Russia, presides by force over an unruly Islamic nation that largely despises him and the war on terror.
Pakistan is considered by terror experts to be the most radicalized Muslim state in the world. In fact, the word Taliban, which means “student,” and which we associate with Afghanistan, actually refers to the Pashtun tribesmen, both Afghan and Pakistani, who left radical Madrassas (Islamic religious schools) to fight Jihad in Afghanistan; first against the Soviets and then against Americans.
Musharraf could never win a fair election in Pakistan. Osama bin Laden would stand a much better chance, were he Pakistani.
Pakistani Scholar Ahmed Rashid told the German magazine Der Spiegel Monday that “Pakistan remains the global center for terrorism and for the remnants of al-Qaeda, which is (sic) still very strong here.“ The attack on London is just the most recent display of that.
Strategic guru George Friedman has predicted that the war on terror would conclude in Pakistan. We may not be nearing the end of the war on terror, but Pakistan seems to be where the conflict is headed next.

I went to the other thread (Kashmiri Pandits). It`s kinda scary out there! Ye kissa hai kya aakhir?

kaalchakra: When we are concerned about future generations, then those of us living in the present clearly share a common goal, namely a more peaceful and progressive world. The curse of too many people is that they dont look ahead. They talk about nothing but ``perceived grievances`` (to use south asians phrase from this board earlier on), and use that as an excuse to do what their own descendants will no doubt curse them for: creating divisions and hatreds among communities that detract from the really important problems (like poverty alleviation).

southasian #168 granted that for the poorest of the urban poor (i.e. those living on the streets), it is not possible to have access to lavatories. Indeed, this is true for homeless people in a wealthy nation like the US as well.

I was not talking of them. How about those who do have a roof over their heads? what stops them from digging a damn hole in the ground, putting four walls around it, and so doing what they have to do without impressing the rest of us with their toilet performance??

re: Ally # 165

Actually, nothing is uniquely wrong with Islam in this regard. *Any* religion will not work in public. The ONLY reason Islam gets so much beaten up on is that its followers are unable to agree on keeping it in the private domain. Once they do so, Islam would immediately severe its commonly-made association with so many ills of our times.


tahmed# 163

You are so right. We are all constantly pulled downward.

``We will be living the rest of our lives in the future`` - surely, one of the greatest lessons of our lives. Thank you.

Re: # 167 Tahmed: Actually something as basic as a lavatory is or is considered to be a luxury by a section of urban poor. In their case it is more of a economic issue than attitudinal shelter and food being the foremost priorities.

southasia #166 Indeed, development issues are the only ones that matter. Everything else is trivial. I have seen for myself the dignity of the poor - not just in India and in Pakistan, and in other parts of Asia, Africa and Latin America. The attitude that poverty and the real life misery of people (not to mention deaths) is something to be mocked that too many posters on chowk have displayed came as a particular surprise after that. Clearly, a person can get advanced college degrees and yet remain primitive in his basic attitudes.

On the subject of sanitation: the most important thing I think is a change in attitude. That happens, I think, when people live in a cleaner environment for a little while. They need to understand that working with your hands to clean up a place is not something to be ashamed of.

Re: # 164 Muqaddam, Kaalchakra, Ajeya, Arjun: I am glad that finally we are talking about development issues. Graphic details provided here by our friends should only serve to make these issues a priority . I wonder if some of our resources could be pooled together to help out these people with basic requirements like sanitation. It will go a long way in making India the country we all cherish so much for it to be.

Will Pakistanis Listen and Act?

No, just some show sha for the gorey, and then all pungas will be back on...

nothing will happen till mullahism policy is reversed.... Islam DOES NOT WORK IN GOVT. we have `experimented` many times, we cannot agree on which kind of Islam etc. its best left to individuals how `Muslim` they want to be...

`Islamic` should be removed from title of Pakistan, Islam is personal and should stay OUT OF POLITICS it should not be used and abused by the dirty politicians... look where the abuse of religion has taken Pakistan, its there for you to see...

Re: # 161
Dear Khansaheb,

Alas, yet another Paki living in self delusion! One never ceases to bump into these diehard types. It is the “we ruled over you” obsession gripping the likes of you that has already taken Pakistan down the drain over the years. Always trying to flex its muscles, thinking that India is just a walk over ( agli namaz Dilli ki Ja’ama masjid mein parhengay ), getting defeated, nay, ousted, routed and dismembered, yet ready to go for another round, like the famous defeated pehalwan who is forever dreaming of chitt karaoing the one that floored him. One just wonders how long you guys are going to get beaten, aren’t you ever going to stop? We are told that in your military academies the gentleman cadets have to take an oath that they shall avenge the defeat of 1971. Ab buss karo! Khansaheb,you have become fat on crumbs thrown at you by the Saudis and other Arabs, and we suppose therefrom this masti . But for how long are you going to keep begging these Sheiks? You renamed Lyallpur as Faisalabad to express your gratitude to the Saudis ( how subservient a qaum can get?), you have named a stadium in Lahore after Gaddafi during a visit when he is said to have come close to the IndoPak border and shouted abuses and spat at India. Remember, the Arab oil is running out, so the Arabs are not going to indulge in a terrorist state for long ( Pakis are suspected of involvement in terror attacks in Arab countries, maybe as a mark of gratitude to the Arabs for their largesses?).
The names of Ghazni, Ghori etc. that you and your ilk keep repeating, for heaven’s sake, cannot be appropriated by you as your own. Your forefathers were Indians and Hindus at that (your mother tongue which is either Punjabi, Sindhi or Avadhi/Bhojpuri/brajwasi(Urdu) clearly establishes that) and not these foreign raiders, looters and rapists. You are us. Your real forefathers also partook of cow urine, so you have it in your blood as much as the Indians !Your great great grandmothers, great great great grand mothers and great great great great grand mothers ( go back for 1200 years, as per your count) were raped by these outsiders and their progeny changed their religion ( obviously not voluntarily). So how much ever you try to appropriate to yourself the ancestry of the attacking hordes from Central Asia, you are nothing but Indians who turned Paki.

As far as defecating crowds, a friend from Central Asia still remembers that he cannot get out of his system the stench of human dung he experienced during his visit to Karachi recently.
For your kind information, as per the latest UN statistics, India’s per capita income is USD 550 where as Pakistan’s is USD 480.

This post was just by the way

Khansahib/kaalchakra: I think, gentlemen, that you are permitting the worst written posts on this board to set the agenda and tone of your discussions.

Khansahib, I share your disgust of posters like Ajeya - they come here with a stupid agenda (i.e. ``Islam is bad, hinduism is good`` in case of Ajeya), not here to educate himself on anything. So, dont waste your time with such posters. I agree with you on the misery and filth one sees in India (having witnessed some of the scenes you mention myself at Bombay airport of all places). But let us not fall to the level of the worst of the Indian posters (and there are plenty) by mocking the real life misery of poor people in India. While in Pakistan we may not have such extreme scenes, there are enough poor people in Pakistan who come pretty close. Let us hope, instead, for progress in the sub-continent where no one has to live in misery.

My second point to Khansahib: Please shed this arrogance that causes you to refer to muslim conquerors of past centuries. Arrogance is the province of losers and fools, and I am sure you are not one of them. I personally believe they violated the fundamental tenets of Islam when they launched their raids on India, btw. Nothing to be proud of. Look instead at where we are today, and where we need to be in the future. Since, as someone said, we will be living the rest of our lives in the future - as will our children, and their children, and so forth. So, looking at the present - India is in my view a part of the solution for Pakistan, not a part of the problem. Peace with India is the surest way to get rid of the poverty I mentioned above that exists in both countries - and which, I repeat, is mocked only by lowlife (of the kind that plenty of Indians on chowk have proved themselves to be). Similarly, India provides an excellent example of military non-interference in politics, and of the democratic process.