Turks: The Bad Part

Re: #11
[As far as racism is concerned, I beg to differ with you. With so much diversity in skin color, hair color, eye color, nasal shape, height, and built, Turks really have no racial pecking order. ...]

In that case they must be DISTINCTLY different from all their neighbors surrounding them. A Lebanese classmate who was dating an American girl used to boast to us that his girlfriend was blonde. The fact that she was blonde was UNDENIABLY a big deal with him.

Now I haven`t done any opinion surveys in that region (and frankly I`ll never go to any Islamic country, or a country with an Islamic majority, although middle easterners mostly don`t know/don`t care about the India/Pakistan thing, but then there could be someone ``misinterpreting`` some verse or another and ``eliminating`` me in the process), but my experience has been that people from that part of the world MOST DEFINITELY have their likes and dislikes aligned along the expected lines - where blond/blue eyed is most coveted etc. This is not the ``bad part`` about Turkey, and neither is it racism, but just shows they are like everybody else.

#14 by Salim_Chauhan

[Ram Bhayya,
She must have felt very secure confiding in you as you sat next to her in your high-heeled shoes, your shocking pink shirt and pea green pants, while you waved your polished fingernails to shoo away the Paki gawkers. ]


I would rather not go into the details of HOW I was sitting next to her.

``....Turks have a freewheeling animosity towards Arabs. Arabs are seen as a dirty, uneducated, chauvinistic, intolerant, extremely religious, totalitarian, hypocritical and bigoted..........``


This is how Afghans see Pakis...with one addition - Cowards

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many even call Pakis Hindus

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bcs of their conversions.

Turks you met seem to be just like people in all other countries to the dot.

Not bad. You missed their ``attitude`` towards the greek. Is there a parallel between tuki-greek relationship and paki-hindu? ottomans were kind of outsiders who came to anatolia and conquered byzentine (eastern roma) empire like the mughals and the greeks, with their stubborn old civilization held on to their ways (no, i am not talking about love of lambs)

[
#10 by tahmed32 on March 18, 2006 10:51am PT
in other words, then, Turks are like people everywhere else. (except indians on chowk, who have made chowk a cesspool - as evidenced by #8 and #9).
]

The dung beetle has spoken.

#13 zeemax
u make it sound so easy. Empire building aint gonna work anymore not even for the USA.

Fenasi,

Kizilbash (regardless of their current geographic location) don`t consider Sunni Turkish very civilized or westernized at all. Turks are considered one narrow minded bastards. You guys are called ``Turke budzad`` among Kizilbash community. I am a third generation Pakistani Kizilbash.

haideri

good article -- with factual analysis

Turks are ``Adhay teetar Adhay batair`` -- neither Europeans nor Asiatic -- this is what happens to country that straddles the two continents -- and depends more on Brawn than on Brain........

Turks are enamored and enchanted by the technology of POWER of the west but never cared for the values that made the West what it is today -- their Sultans were nothing more than the annual plunderers of Europe --

every year during summer the Turkish Sultans will assemble an army of fortune hunters and head westward on the annual expedition to invade plunder and catch slaves -- all over Europe -- no wonder the East Europeans especially the Greeks the Bulgars and the Serbs despise them to this day -- because they bore the brunt of their conquests and reconquests every year --

in the Arab world and the Muslim world -- up to the last Sultan Abdul Hamid -- the Turks enjoyed their position as Khalifatul-Muslimeen of all Islamic countries and Muslims in general all over the world -- considered themselves the custodians of Kaaba -- ruled Egypt and Middle East like medieval colonial power -- doing nothing to improve the lot of the people of those countries except using the brute force....

....because the Turks themselves were medieval....

the Greeks and the Arabs rightly complain that the country responsible for the decline of their culture, scholarship and past grandeur -- were the Turks -- they claim that where ever the Turks went they deprived those countries of their civilization, education, fine arts and scientific progress.....

because unlike the Western colonialists the backward Turkish colonials had nothing to offer to the colonized countries towards modernity......

Kemal Ataturk`s greatest contribution was that he secularized the once deeply religious country -- separated religion from State with the zeal that bordered on almost fanaticism --

but in the very hasty process Ataturk threw the baby with the tub water -- he threw thousand year history and culture and traditions of a very traditional community and made the Turks a past-less history-less community overnight......floating anchorless between the two very traditional and different continents..

...a little like post 47 Pakistan --

and that was Ataturk`s greatest folly -- that sowed the seeds of the failure of Turkish society to neither assimilate with the West nor with the East.......a shallow community with no past and no future.....except plenty of brawn not much of brain.....

......returning BACK to Islamism rather than going forward to essence of Europeanism...

Re: # 25 Turks are inferior to Pakistanis and Indians.
Pakistan is not white still major Nato friend of USA while Turkey just carrying weight of Europeans.
They still do not know making atomic bombs. Even though white still they want to be Wanabe European and they drink alcohol and eat pork and lard pig fat mixed breads. It is strange they are white still backward. They have history , they went up to Vinnena and put terror in hearts of white chritians so much there the famous music ( westen) symphony, Turkish death March. They are full of envy and lasosy and greed of Arabs where american presidents go on begging for black liquid gold. They are not liking Arabs as they kicked them and they are filthy rich. Turks are recist against Africans while Arabs are mix of turks and dark skined africans so they like dark colored people and got great strength like blacks of America. Now even white iranian have lots black blood as one can see habashis in Abadan and they are considered inferior Iranis.
I wonder why to go to backward country like turk from Pakistan I think many feel to just find gora chamadi wife as he feels his daughters will have no hard time to find nice husband. They are white and that is advantage but how one can become white just going to turkey land. Anyway its not good weather there too hot and cold. They hate mr. Hussain as he used to have lots of oil but he will be dead soon as brave tiger but Turks have become slave of usa.
IRP has done much better in human rights, industry, war industry and is able to put up with India on equal basis though they have more people. But Pakistan has racial advantage of being cream colored compared to Indians. Also mighty warriers blood mixing has made a special man in pakistan who is sturdy and and hard working. Even though has not got gifts from USA like turkey is more advanced for sure. Pakistan has produced nobel prize and scientists like Dr. Khan turkey is no where.

I just wonder what turks think about indians a dark brown race of polygot people who are dark like rats but far advanced than turks. It is some times shock to see turks not advanced as dark Indians. Real white people have some good intelligent people who control world by intelluctual power . In between is problem. Even in India cream colored+ little coal mix north Indians are generally no good in brain dept. Like afghan are no like European but darker they are jungi people and they are in state of mind. While dark colored people have no complex of darkness they are at ease with their color and so their brain works better. Pakistan+North Indian are agricultural people with culture as agricultural that is reflected in like flying kite or holi etc or Bhangara as music. All Turkey to North India people hyas not ``color`` problem and Turkey land must have accute problem so these retards and just waste time in childhood how to marry whiter skinned person and when parents all time wasted in how to find whiter boy for dark daughter and and raise color cream complexion by mixing whiter blood. All stupid time goes in feeling they are white monkeys. No do not blame me but at heart pakistani expak marries white buffolow from usa but will not marry dark colored wheatish beautiful boy or girl beautiful like dear with dark dovey eyes. Real pakistani and India at heart wants his daughter or boy marry white person person so grand children are milk white. And many time results are not good as children still look like deshi and people can easily find blood mixing as dark deshi color has more dominence and mixture is dark chakolate. Any way India will go ahead as they have dark colored [people and they have spared from such complex so they mind is free to think about things. As these people smart and that can definitely has Indian advantage. Even in our country we know all important people are Indian urdus with dark color and all retards dominate in feudal cream colored Punjabis and sindhis and they just want to punish them as their retard children can not stand against MQM followers so retards started Urban and rural divide to punish dark people. Our country lost last chance when we lost dark skinned bengalis, that was last hope but retards wanted to get them out out so retards will be lords of country. I like General he has shopwn place to retard gora prime minister. General should whip retards if he wants to improve avaerage IQ. Any way India has dark people and has advantaged on creamy racist retards. It is sad but true.

i have asked this question a few times to urstruly. the middle eastern countries blame western colonization for their current siege mentality and general angst. ottomans colonized the entire populance from basra to berberistan until 1918 for 400 years...so that influence ought to be a more lasting legacy. why is this legacy ommitted in the narration of the middle-eastern hagiography according to the ummah.

Re: # 26 zeemax

I agree with everything you wrote in #26 ... no disputing the facts. But on the question of mindset, I submit to you that what you say is true today. In the years to come, as the old foggies die out, the attitude of the younger generation is going to be different and in a decade or two things will change sufficiently to where Turkey will be accepted... that is to say IF the European Union survives in its present form. I have a feeling that the EU may not last and may be reduced to a common market rather than become a United States of Europe. Their common currency, the Zero (popularly known as the Euro), is a fiasco and was implemented in the most absurd manner...(more about that another time)... and the so-called EU constitution is another disaster... its simply a nice thought that is being played out as a series of bad policies and I don`t see it going too far. Unlike the 1789 experiment of the United States, this EU nonsense cannot survive two centuries unless these old stupid European attitudes change radically.

So, in conclusion, I believe we are saying the same thing more or less. In an EU that has the present mindset Turkey is out. But if this mindset does not change the EU will also die. Conversely, if the attitude changes over time, as I believe it may, then EU may also have a longer term future. And if that happens, Turkey will also be in.

...SR

#21 by SR

SR I acknowledge your argument fully re the `greying populations` of EU and the apparent impossibility of meeting social welfare commitments with retirees with less and less taxpayers in the long term. This problem is not only of EU but all of developed world including Japan outside of USA (immigration policies, low-birth rates, falling apart family systems and so forth). But my dear SR, they have other alternatives to solve this problem. Let me make the following points:

1) Globalisation ensures unchecked (indeed welcomed) outsourcing of the lowest value-added, labour intensive, generic, and mass produced but necessary goods and services for the developed world to countries with large pools of low/semi skilled, low paid labour force; while the capital intensive, highly value-added, proprietary production is handled in-house by small pools of a highly skilled, highly paid labour force. Generous investments in R&D at the same time retains Europe`s cutting edge, while globalisation at the same time ensures that such value addition cannot now take place anywhere else.

2) The continuous value addition and wage growth means higher fiscal revenues for the EU countries. Every single knowledge worker of EU contributes more to the tax base than a hundred waiters imported from Turkey in, say, Germany, and thus to the retirement plans of a greying population.

3) Take Japan which has the most serious problem of them all. Japan is hit not only by one of the lowest birth rates in the world ... but ... also the highest life expectancy. Today, Japan`s proportion of elderly, at 19%, is the highest in the world, but, forecast to reach almost 30% by 2025. So what did Japan do to compensate for this? What it actually did is a lesson in long-term strategy. It willingly handed over ALL it`s captive world market for low-end consumer electronics, household white goods and automotive products ten years ago to Korea and China, while it moved up yet further in the high-end value addition chain. It didn`t import any workers from anywhere to keep making the cheap stuff; it just either outsourced it to Malaysia or Thailand or simply abandoned the low-end market. Thus, One container load of merchandise from China or Korea is of less value now than a small consignment from a Japanese worker. And they started with making plastic toys remember? It wasn`t that long ago.

The name of the game is value-addition. Globalisation effectively monopolises that.

Above are merely the economic realities. There is another factor which I consider overriding above them all ... and that is the mindset. I have occasion to meet with the senior ECB officials from time to time. Whenever asked the question of Turkey`s membership of EU, their body language is sufficient answer.

Thus, the lure of Europe is a carrot dangled only to keep Turkey from drifting towards Ialmaic radicalism, which they have and always had a high propensity of doing, and never really meant anything other than that.

Rgds

#24 by nasah

Nasah you are right. Ata-turd threw out the baby with the bath water ...

Re: # 29
You have good point.
Color is not important real problem is discrimaination based on look. But its better to be father of fair daughters than dark as its hard job.
Ugly people are discriminated all time. If you look at top places most are good looking and ugly looking people are not liked for no reason but being ugly.

#28 by ahmedmadani

C`mon. Don`t get stuck up in colours. Rainbow is all different colours but starting from the same place, going in the same direction, and ending up in the same place. There`s no difference.

Rgds