Scream

Re: # 95, Behram, you said: ````Pakistan needs planes and materials etc. from the west.````

Behram, and other Pakistani interactors here, when needed, Pakistan`s Great Believer Friends from just one country, Saudi Arabia, can move millions of people (for a fairly hefty fee, of course) from all over the world to do a pilgrimage that involves every form of airplane, ship, heavy machinery, infrastructure building, the works.

The Haj organisations alone could have moved more relief material into Kashmir if they had wanted to. There are full tented cities with all requirements including hospitals lying ready and packed, but then, no, you guys want it from NATO and the US. Wow, what brilliance, what dignity, what religious truth.

Apart from sending preachers and fundamentalists to prey on the minds of the already devastated, what else have you seen by way of planes and materials from your Believer friends, then? Has even one of those personal airplanes parked at airports all over the Arab countries been put on medical repatriation duty, carrying injured Pakistanis to superb hospitals built all over the deserts? (with Indian and Pakistani labour, sure . . .)

You need planes and materials from the West like you need a collective hole in your heads, to borrow words already borrowed by Ayaz Amir.

You need to take whatever is coming your way and just get along with saving lives. How does it matter what colour a cat is if it kills mice?

Your people up there in the mountains, they know this, and they are voting with their feet as they walk towards the LOC to send their weak and wounded into Jammu & Kashmir. You and your sort can pull those ``India is the enemy`` arguments out of your socks again and again, but for the rest of the world, the toe-jam is smelly and old and not viable anymore, so put it back in.

Every refugee who walks across the LOC is going to have a story about how s/he could have saved another few lives if the Indians had been allowed to help earlier. Watch it on the television in a few days.

And what good will screaming be, then?

Chowk staff please take note of Rsidhar`s abuse against Pakistanis...

#90 by rsridhar on October 24, 2005 8:45pm PT
re:#88 by behram1
Your worst enemy, Mr Mofukcer, is your own Army and the shitty brain of yours and your countrymen which thinks Army is your saviour.
sridhar
[Reply to interact #90]


#89 by rsridhar on October 24, 2005 8:43pm PT
re:#85 by behram1
It hurts because i have to constantly interact with mofuckers like u.
Sridhar
[Reply to interact #89]


--

Behram...

Keep your head high my friend...

These Gandhian tactics, this abuse, hypocrisy and double standards never worked... they will never work..

So let Rsridhar, Gandhiji`s biggest follower, roll around in his own defaecation.

#99 by Mantolives

[These Gandhian tactics, this abuse, hypocrisy and double standards never worked... they will never work..]

OTOH, old boy Jinnah`s tactics like propaganda, blackmail, and rioting might just work fine. So keep trying Behram, you might get there one day!

Sorry folks, I have no intention of turning this into another Gandhi-Jinnah slanging match, but simply could not resist this.

Nope thats all Gandhian dear boy... all Gandhian.

I appreciate the impartiality, justice and fair play that the chowk staff have demonstrated by banning Sadna, the other foul-mouthed Gandhian, earlier today.

Hopefuly rsridhar will be dealt with the same way soon.

Re: # 102, Yasser, please don`t change the course of this debate, which is about the benefits of screaming versus actually doing something.

Please, instead, let us know what you and your close friends have actually done to prepare for looking after the refugees who will soon stream out of POK. We shall look after many of them in India, but I do feel that at least SOME of them should be provided habitats in Lahore, don`t you think, especially the bearded fundamental types? I mean, they will merge so well with the jihab boxes and the Raiwind gatherings and the Dunkin` Donuts?

I notice that my appeal from Pakistani chowkies for help in renting a ``farmhouse`` for Kashmiri refugees from POK in or around `Pindi has resulted in a deafening silence from most especially Romair, and a revival of the evergreen Jinnah versus Gandhi debate by Yasser.

``Please, instead, let us know what you and your close friends have actually done to prepare for looking after the refugees who will soon stream out of POK. ``


This must be a very Indian thing... to boast about what you`ve done. Whatever I have done is for my countrymen and not to score brownie points. As for the nature of debate... you are really funny for someone well advanced in his years... first you make a mockery of a great tragedy... then you politicise this discussion...

As for Gandhi discussion... I am afraid I merely used the term ``Gandhian`` as an insult.
If Rsridhar is calling everyone left right and centre ``mofuckers``... is he starting a discussion on incest? Please think before you speak.

Re: # 104, Yasser, this is not an ``Indian thing``. What India is doing is carried based on reportage from the Pakistani media. For example, please comment on this, as I am told that Daily Times is a fine newspaper?

````The Indian army is readying medical facilities, building bridges, clearing landmines and rushing supplies to its militarised frontier in expectation of a flood of stricken earthquake survivors from Pakistan, officials said on Monday.```` (Daily Times/25oct`05)

http://www.dailytimes.com.pk/default.asp?page=2005%5C10%5C25%5Cstory_25-10-2005_pg7_46

And here`s more from the same report:-

````The brigadier said that his engineers had built a three-kilometre stretch of road to connect Chakan Dabagh to the Indian garrison supply town of Poonch in southern Kashmir. Elsewhere, Indian army engineers were installing a “flying fox” bridge across the Neelum river at Teetwal in northern Tangdhar district and soldiers were ferrying food by mule to Kaman Post in the devastated Uri district the two other points India has proposed as relief centers.

Engineers said they had been working non-stop since on Tuesday to clear landmines from the LoC to allow the safe crossing of earthquake survivors. Colonel Hemant Juneja, the Indian army’s chief spokesman in Kashmir, said New Delhi would be flexible on the relief efforts. “First of all, Teetwal and Kaman Post will also act as main relief supply stores with communications and all other logistics,” Juneja said. “It will now depend on Pakistan to accept whether our civilian doctors go across the LoC, or let people come to our relief camps, and allow the injured to come across for treatment and then go back. These are the possibilities,” the colonel said.````

+++

I am not making a mockery out of anything. I am only saying in a nutshell that while screaming is of some use to build perceptions, you must make the environment such that people can see and document why you are screaming. And simultaneously you must do something too, as well as not stop others from doing something.

+++

And to others from Pakistan, I reiterate, the Indian Armed Forces have a well-defined role in disaster relief within India and abroad which seems logical enough to us in India. Without scoring brownie points or anything, maybe some of that screaming could be used to try to convince your obdurate countrymen that this can really be so, that the Indian Army will not come into Pakistan and ``seize power`` like the Pakistani Army does every now and then.

The Indian Armed Forces return to their barracks after doing their job internationally, whatever it be, and East Pakistan/Bangladesh 1971 is a very valid example.

#96 by Romair on October 24, 2005 9:34pm PT

[They can be put into the education dept., and sent back to the villages as teachers........]

Well, that should be easy to accomplish given the fact that the Paki Army is not very famous for its fighting skills, as evidenced in the last 3 wars it fought. Had those 93,000 soldiers been teachers, they wouldn`t have had to face the ignominy of being taken as POWs in 1971.

Veeresh...

My reference was not to the Indian Army- whatever it is supposedly doing. I think the world can see what it is or isn`t doing.

My reference was to the fact that you feel that I should report to you whatever I might or might not have done for the earthquake victims.

Sorry to get here “late”!

Here is what I read from the interacts –

(1) This thing started out with a commiseration session – all right and proper.
(2) Someone said – “why did you decline Indian help?” Somebody else said – we got enough SOLDIEIRS, give us stuff instead!
(3) All kinds of heated buck-waas followed.

Here is my conclusion – right from the beginning, instead of saying “Yes, but….”, everyone should have said just “Yes!” and stopped, because the rest was bound to follow.

Let’s do this!

The mistrust level here is too high!

It’s time for that mythical creature – chowk staff – to show some REAL guts!

Delete all comments (including this one) for being off-topic – except for the following (#1, #3, #“5”, #9, #11, #15, #19, #21, #42, #51, #53, #64, #68, #69, #71,and #74).

Be a MAN – chowk staff – no matter what your gender!

Let us not mess up what MUST remain a somber, sobering experience that mother nature apparently tries to knock into our heads.

Once in a while!

There must be a reason! Right?

Veeresh/rsridhar:

i think there is no point arguing about sending indian help to pak. There is just too much of mistrust. we should be take care of ourselves and help, if asked. there are a million affected in bengal right now. The more you guys will insist, more suspicious pakis will get.

Manto:

keep gandhi out of this.

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Re: # 96

Dear Romair:

Thank you for the response.

I do understand that the unemployment of the armed forces should be gradual. They should also consider the rate of those new comers coming into the economy. As such, I do not think that throwing so many people into the economy is feasable. However, I do see their role in the regular policing activity. Due to their high level of training they may better serve in the regular police force, and help the law and order situation, which is abysmal to say the least. The question then becomes - how should they handle the higher officers of the armed forces? Will they be satisfied with being a low paid police officer? I doubt it.

I certainly do not agree with the present situation that all the retired (or retarded, whatever the case might be) Generals somehow become the head honcho of Pakistan`s various infrastructure. An enlightened leadership should definitely avoid that. But, they (the present leadership) can`t, because that is the price paid for getting their (the retired generals`) fealty in the first place.

Respectfully submitted,