And Dr. Shahid Hussain Bokhari Quits…
Omer Cheema November 3, 2005
#29 Posted by javaxprt on November 7, 2005 6:50:41 pm
Re: # 27
But you know what, now we are orphans without our spritual father. I will eager to see another pakistani to produce ``Silicon Valley Engineers`` from poor villages of Pakistan who first saw keyboard in Bokhari`s lab. In just 4 years he leaves 300+ pakistanis to earn with grace and honor each year. Sad for my country...
Now he will benefit to many but not pakistanis...
But you know what, now we are orphans without our spritual father. I will eager to see another pakistani to produce ``Silicon Valley Engineers`` from poor villages of Pakistan who first saw keyboard in Bokhari`s lab. In just 4 years he leaves 300+ pakistanis to earn with grace and honor each year. Sad for my country...
Now he will benefit to many but not pakistanis...
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#28 Posted by javaxprt on November 7, 2005 6:15:48 pm
We have lost a factory producing highly skilled engineers every year. Sad for my country where teachers have no respect.
#27 Posted by Beej on November 7, 2005 6:09:46 pm
I like this gentleman – Dr. Shahid Bokhari, as he is described here. (I have a soft corner for educators, too.)
The Good Lord knows our subcontinent can use all the good professors it can get – we need original thinkers like never before – thinkers who can get us out of that sixty year rut – we need them a LOT more than we need those darn khakis – whose only skill is to destroy and to kill – when they are not busy doing other activities for which they were not meant – like grabbing benefits for themselves and crushing average Pakistanis under their boots – and the irony is these critters consider themselves super-patriots!
It is quite clear that a person of Dr. Bokhari’s qualifications will do quite well no matter where he goes.
The support from his students is truly touching – and this type of support is very much ingrained in our culture – it’s quite foreign to the Westerners! I touched upon a bit of that theme in an earlier i-log entitled “The Pale Horse”. If anybody missed it and wishes to see it, I’ll be happy to put up an encore version.
Dr. Bokhari, if you are reading this – please don’t get disheartened by the turn of events. Please remember that there is still a lot that you can accomplish from OUTSIDE the country – perhaps a lot more than you could have done from inside – since there won’t be a bureaucracy to encumber you! You will miss the direct contact with your present students but you can serve as a source of inspiration from outside – especially by becoming even more successful – far more than the wildest dreams of what would be possible under the present clowns and “without the constant aggravations”! I wish you the best of luck!
#26 Posted by javaxprt on November 7, 2005 5:41:56 pm
Re: # 24
Hi, Kulhari. I want to know about your profession and education?
Hi, Kulhari. I want to know about your profession and education?
#25 Posted by viewer on November 7, 2005 12:17:48 pm
Re: # 24
Leaving in humility is worse than leaving in protest especially when you strongly disagree on policy matters. A humble resignation conveys the OK sign to the administrators sitting in HEC. It is also not question of leaving for greener grass. If that were the case, Prof. Bokhari must have had left much earlier. Policies of HEC during recent years are forcing existing researching to leave the country; while HEC is trying to bring ex-patriates at much higher pays in the so-called foreign faculty hiring program. In the first preference HEC must try to convince the existing researcher not to leave the country. Prof. Bokhari is not alone, Prof. Suhail Zubairy from Electronics Deptt of QAU also left a couple of years ago almost on similar grounds, I suppose. His departure, Like that of Prof. Bokhari`s, is damaging because no one of his stature in quantum optics is left in this country.
Leaving in humility is worse than leaving in protest especially when you strongly disagree on policy matters. A humble resignation conveys the OK sign to the administrators sitting in HEC. It is also not question of leaving for greener grass. If that were the case, Prof. Bokhari must have had left much earlier. Policies of HEC during recent years are forcing existing researching to leave the country; while HEC is trying to bring ex-patriates at much higher pays in the so-called foreign faculty hiring program. In the first preference HEC must try to convince the existing researcher not to leave the country. Prof. Bokhari is not alone, Prof. Suhail Zubairy from Electronics Deptt of QAU also left a couple of years ago almost on similar grounds, I suppose. His departure, Like that of Prof. Bokhari`s, is damaging because no one of his stature in quantum optics is left in this country.
#24 Posted by Kulharee on November 7, 2005 10:21:50 am
Re: # 23
Charlie, all is well and understood, my point was only about his lack of ‘humility’. You have to be a little humble about being such an esteemed professor to whom students look up to (i.e., going as far as calling him their “spiritual father’). If you are in such a position, you CANNOT sound egotistical arrogant (which he does in his letter) no matter what the circumstance. All his points (paragraphs) end with “It is unacceptable”. That in itself reeks of superciliousness and takes away any validity in his disagreements, even if he had any.
And Charlie, I don’t know what kind of circumstances prevail in UET or HEC, but there are people who achieve more (within and outwith Pakistan) by being humble and steadfast in their convictions. He is the one abandoning the Ship, while he blames others for that. Do you see that logic? That my friend is something that you, as a young student, need to learn. Last night Neil Armstrong was on 60 minutes (his first interview ever) and you know what he said? He said that he didn’t deserve all the attention and whatnot, because landing on the moon was an effort behind which 40,000 people stood… talk about Humility and Rocket science. I hope that the weight of the entire UET EE department doesn’t break the shoulder bone of Professor sahib.
Yes, and with the grace of Allah Subhanawatallah, I am not an EE. To me an EE is no more than someone who changes bulbs in my office, and once a while comes to take my meter reading.
Charlie, all is well and understood, my point was only about his lack of ‘humility’. You have to be a little humble about being such an esteemed professor to whom students look up to (i.e., going as far as calling him their “spiritual father’). If you are in such a position, you CANNOT sound egotistical arrogant (which he does in his letter) no matter what the circumstance. All his points (paragraphs) end with “It is unacceptable”. That in itself reeks of superciliousness and takes away any validity in his disagreements, even if he had any.
And Charlie, I don’t know what kind of circumstances prevail in UET or HEC, but there are people who achieve more (within and outwith Pakistan) by being humble and steadfast in their convictions. He is the one abandoning the Ship, while he blames others for that. Do you see that logic? That my friend is something that you, as a young student, need to learn. Last night Neil Armstrong was on 60 minutes (his first interview ever) and you know what he said? He said that he didn’t deserve all the attention and whatnot, because landing on the moon was an effort behind which 40,000 people stood… talk about Humility and Rocket science. I hope that the weight of the entire UET EE department doesn’t break the shoulder bone of Professor sahib.
Yes, and with the grace of Allah Subhanawatallah, I am not an EE. To me an EE is no more than someone who changes bulbs in my office, and once a while comes to take my meter reading.
#23 Posted by Charlie on November 7, 2005 9:12:14 am
Kulhari!
As far as your ``Oman Chair`` vs lack of professors in Pakistan logic is concerned, I think that HEC should be sensible enough to realize that any of their policies should not hurt those professors who have been serving voluntarily for decades and are having the feeling that they were superceded by other professors who returned after looking at more money although they were less concerned with their cause and stayed away when they were needed more...
#2 Non serious comments ignored. :)
#3 thanks for the comments Irfan.
#4 And EE is not a rocket science.
lolzzzzz. Rocket science is less complex than EE. You are an admin guy. I understand the reasons for your bad understanding. :)
#11 hggsfinder, Not that sciences are lesser than engineering. But if some institute is a specialized place, it should not be generalized. If Engineering was its speciality, why to mix other stuff that we are not sure if it will have the same standard or no.
HEC has been opening a lot of universities and converting colleges into universities, why not to take pure sciences to that universities ?
LASTLY, Dr Bokhari is an expert educationist. After spending 25 years at the place, he knows much more than me or anyone else on this forum. My Point is if HEC is using the experience of existing educationists and researchers or they are mere armchair policy makers.
I think, one big reason for his discouraging exit from UET is that UET is run by a retired military officer who doesn`t know what the researchers think and what they feel? As a result, intentionally or un-intentionally, he keeps on discouraging the good researchers. I can count half dozen good PhDs quitting EE Department during last fgew years under his administration.
Thanks all for the showing the concern. :)
As far as your ``Oman Chair`` vs lack of professors in Pakistan logic is concerned, I think that HEC should be sensible enough to realize that any of their policies should not hurt those professors who have been serving voluntarily for decades and are having the feeling that they were superceded by other professors who returned after looking at more money although they were less concerned with their cause and stayed away when they were needed more...
#2 Non serious comments ignored. :)
#3 thanks for the comments Irfan.
#4 And EE is not a rocket science.
lolzzzzz. Rocket science is less complex than EE. You are an admin guy. I understand the reasons for your bad understanding. :)
#11 hggsfinder, Not that sciences are lesser than engineering. But if some institute is a specialized place, it should not be generalized. If Engineering was its speciality, why to mix other stuff that we are not sure if it will have the same standard or no.
HEC has been opening a lot of universities and converting colleges into universities, why not to take pure sciences to that universities ?
LASTLY, Dr Bokhari is an expert educationist. After spending 25 years at the place, he knows much more than me or anyone else on this forum. My Point is if HEC is using the experience of existing educationists and researchers or they are mere armchair policy makers.
I think, one big reason for his discouraging exit from UET is that UET is run by a retired military officer who doesn`t know what the researchers think and what they feel? As a result, intentionally or un-intentionally, he keeps on discouraging the good researchers. I can count half dozen good PhDs quitting EE Department during last fgew years under his administration.
Thanks all for the showing the concern. :)
#22 Posted by soysauce on November 7, 2005 7:57:40 am
Sounds like Dr. Bokhari is an accomplished individual who loves to teach. I find tho that his litany of complaints is fairly trivial at one level (someone else got better labs, etc. which is a common complaint everywhere) and it`s not clear how his resigning would help matters at all. Maybe he doesn`t want to be a part of what he considers a failing institution and this is just an elaborate rationalization for him wanting to move to greener pastures.
He also seems to want to preserve UET as purely engg college surprising considering that he himself is in a very interdisciplinary field. A place like MIT is phenomenal precisely because the distinction between pure and applied sciences is deliberately blurred. In some departments like ChemE the faculty consists of renowned physical chemists who never studied engg but are at the cutting edge of ChemE!
Students need to be exposed to interdisciplinary thinking unless the purpose of UET is simply to turn out serviceable engineers in which case Dr. Bokhari`s complaints have NO merit at all.
He also seems to want to preserve UET as purely engg college surprising considering that he himself is in a very interdisciplinary field. A place like MIT is phenomenal precisely because the distinction between pure and applied sciences is deliberately blurred. In some departments like ChemE the faculty consists of renowned physical chemists who never studied engg but are at the cutting edge of ChemE!
Students need to be exposed to interdisciplinary thinking unless the purpose of UET is simply to turn out serviceable engineers in which case Dr. Bokhari`s complaints have NO merit at all.
#21 Posted by ominam on November 6, 2005 11:24:48 pm
Re: # 16
@ higgsfinder: ``UET was a purely engineering institute is no reason for it to be good. In my opinion, introducing the sciences is a very good step. Why do we think the sciences are any lower than engineering. The world-over physics and maths are considered to be the most challenging fields. Plus all of engineering requires a lot of maths and physics to make sense of things. I do not understand why Dr Bokhari would write such a thing.``
Dr. Bokhari`s point wasnt this at all. He didnt mean to say that physics and maths should not be a part of the institution. What he said was: ``With the initiation of pure science and mathematics programs in the UET the level of teaching and research has started going down precipitously.`` I being a current student of uet know that after the initiation of maths and pure science programs, senior professors of physics and maths who first taught engineering students their required courses, now only teach the students of these programs. Because of the shortage of senior teachers, the engineering students are left to the mercy of fresh graduates and new recruits who have no experience at all. This in turn affects the engineering students greatly as they require strong background of physics and maths to understand the concepts of engineering itself and freshly recruited teachers can hardly ever give them this.
@ higgsfinder: ``UET was a purely engineering institute is no reason for it to be good. In my opinion, introducing the sciences is a very good step. Why do we think the sciences are any lower than engineering. The world-over physics and maths are considered to be the most challenging fields. Plus all of engineering requires a lot of maths and physics to make sense of things. I do not understand why Dr Bokhari would write such a thing.``
Dr. Bokhari`s point wasnt this at all. He didnt mean to say that physics and maths should not be a part of the institution. What he said was: ``With the initiation of pure science and mathematics programs in the UET the level of teaching and research has started going down precipitously.`` I being a current student of uet know that after the initiation of maths and pure science programs, senior professors of physics and maths who first taught engineering students their required courses, now only teach the students of these programs. Because of the shortage of senior teachers, the engineering students are left to the mercy of fresh graduates and new recruits who have no experience at all. This in turn affects the engineering students greatly as they require strong background of physics and maths to understand the concepts of engineering itself and freshly recruited teachers can hardly ever give them this.
#20 Posted by ominam on November 6, 2005 11:23:34 pm
Re: # 16
@ higgsfinder: ``UET was a purely engineering institute is no reason for it to be good. In my opinion, introducing the sciences is a very good step. Why do we think the sciences are any lower than engineering. The world-over physics and maths are considered to be the most challenging fields. Plus all of engineering requires a lot of maths and physics to make sense of things. I do not understand why Dr Bokhari would write such a thing.``
Dr. Bokhari`s point wasnt this at all. He didnt mean to say that physics and maths should not be a part of the institution. What he said was: ``With the initiation of pure science and mathematics programs in the UET the level of teaching and research has started going down precipitously.`` I being a current student of uet know that after the initiation of maths and pure science programs, senior professors of physics and maths who first taught engineering students their required courses, now only teach the students of these programs. Because of the shortage of senior teachers, the engineering students are left to the mercy of fresh graduates and new recruits who have no experience at all. This in turn affects the engineering students greatly as they require strong background of physics and maths to understand the concepts of engineering itself and freshly recruited teachers can hardly ever give them this.
@ higgsfinder: ``UET was a purely engineering institute is no reason for it to be good. In my opinion, introducing the sciences is a very good step. Why do we think the sciences are any lower than engineering. The world-over physics and maths are considered to be the most challenging fields. Plus all of engineering requires a lot of maths and physics to make sense of things. I do not understand why Dr Bokhari would write such a thing.``
Dr. Bokhari`s point wasnt this at all. He didnt mean to say that physics and maths should not be a part of the institution. What he said was: ``With the initiation of pure science and mathematics programs in the UET the level of teaching and research has started going down precipitously.`` I being a current student of uet know that after the initiation of maths and pure science programs, senior professors of physics and maths who first taught engineering students their required courses, now only teach the students of these programs. Because of the shortage of senior teachers, the engineering students are left to the mercy of fresh graduates and new recruits who have no experience at all. This in turn affects the engineering students greatly as they require strong background of physics and maths to understand the concepts of engineering itself and freshly recruited teachers can hardly ever give them this.
#19 Posted by patwari on November 6, 2005 11:10:11 pm
sad how we continue to undermine the best minds ... but I not surprized the least and this kind of shame will go on ...
#18 Posted by Jamesmaxwell on November 6, 2005 11:05:11 am
I was one of Professor Bukhari`s students in the mid 90`s. He was one of the best. As an undergraduate I did not know much about his research activities, but his teaching was inspirational. His departure is a big loss to the UET.
#17 Posted by ZahraJ on November 5, 2005 5:10:57 pm
Omar:
It is obvious that you have a lot of respect and regard for your teacher. You have done the right thing by raising your due concern. In my opinion, Dr. Bokari should go where he has respect, better opportunity and intellectual satisfaction. Life is too short to waste on a system where your positive energies are spent in fighting. Why not preserve those energies and utilize them elsewhere? I agree with Kulhari`s brazen but well said thoughts. It`s time for Mr. Bokhari to move on. What is HEC? Higher Education Committee or Council?
It is obvious that you have a lot of respect and regard for your teacher. You have done the right thing by raising your due concern. In my opinion, Dr. Bokari should go where he has respect, better opportunity and intellectual satisfaction. Life is too short to waste on a system where your positive energies are spent in fighting. Why not preserve those energies and utilize them elsewhere? I agree with Kulhari`s brazen but well said thoughts. It`s time for Mr. Bokhari to move on. What is HEC? Higher Education Committee or Council?
#16 Posted by viewer on November 5, 2005 4:19:34 pm
Re: # 11
higgsfinder: ``UET was a purely engineering institute is no reason for it to be good. In my opinion, introducing the sciences is a very good step. Why do we think the sciences are any lower than engineering. The world-over physics and maths are considered to be the most challenging fields. Plus all of engineering requires a lot of maths and physics to make sense of things. I do not understand why Dr Bokhari would write such a thing.``
Re: Certainly a right comment and I think Prof. Dr. Bukhari must answer it.
Prof. Bukhari: ``With the initiation of pure science and mathematics programs in the UET the level of teaching and research has started going down precipitously``
Re: I also don`t understand the meaning and context of such a comment from Prof. Bukhari. Could Prof. Bukhari post a reply?
Prof. Bukhari: ``We were able to achieve this status because the UET (and formerly the Maclagan College) were exclusively engineering institutions where the rigors of engineering education could be exercised in isolation from the overall poor level of our Nation`s general universities.``
Re: I believe the (high) ``status`` is indeed reserved for Prof. Bukhari only. Extending it beyond may be exaggeration. How come the (application of) ``the rigors of engineering education`` (without the impurifying effects of basic sciences) is guaranteed to lead to the so-called ``higer levels`` of the UET education? Could Prof. Bukhari please reply? I don`t think Pakistan, as a country, can be placed at significantly higher position in its engineering achievements if Prof. Bukhari is rated by ISI as one of the most cited author. However, I can certainly see a very strange sense of engineers placing themselves somehow higher in getting quality education, which I don`t realy believe can be justified just from the records of ISI.
higgsfinder: ``UET was a purely engineering institute is no reason for it to be good. In my opinion, introducing the sciences is a very good step. Why do we think the sciences are any lower than engineering. The world-over physics and maths are considered to be the most challenging fields. Plus all of engineering requires a lot of maths and physics to make sense of things. I do not understand why Dr Bokhari would write such a thing.``
Re: Certainly a right comment and I think Prof. Dr. Bukhari must answer it.
Prof. Bukhari: ``With the initiation of pure science and mathematics programs in the UET the level of teaching and research has started going down precipitously``
Re: I also don`t understand the meaning and context of such a comment from Prof. Bukhari. Could Prof. Bukhari post a reply?
Prof. Bukhari: ``We were able to achieve this status because the UET (and formerly the Maclagan College) were exclusively engineering institutions where the rigors of engineering education could be exercised in isolation from the overall poor level of our Nation`s general universities.``
Re: I believe the (high) ``status`` is indeed reserved for Prof. Bukhari only. Extending it beyond may be exaggeration. How come the (application of) ``the rigors of engineering education`` (without the impurifying effects of basic sciences) is guaranteed to lead to the so-called ``higer levels`` of the UET education? Could Prof. Bukhari please reply? I don`t think Pakistan, as a country, can be placed at significantly higher position in its engineering achievements if Prof. Bukhari is rated by ISI as one of the most cited author. However, I can certainly see a very strange sense of engineers placing themselves somehow higher in getting quality education, which I don`t realy believe can be justified just from the records of ISI.
#15 Posted by abdurehman_2000 on November 5, 2005 5:12:21 am
Thank you Omer Cheema for bringing this very important piece of news to the attention of all the chowk members.
I am indeed deeply saddened by his resignation. I know a good deal about UET and I can tell you the only good thing that has ever happened to UET was Dr. Bokhari and now he`s gone.
Thanks Again.
Regards
I am indeed deeply saddened by his resignation. I know a good deal about UET and I can tell you the only good thing that has ever happened to UET was Dr. Bokhari and now he`s gone.
Thanks Again.
Regards
#14 Posted by bbabu on November 4, 2005 9:22:10 pm
Dr. Shahid Hussain Bokhari has an impressive resume. I am sure he will do well anywhere he goes. Wish him the best.
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