If Robert Fisk were Rameez Farooq…

rsridhar #131
First of all I did not start interacting with you at all. Just go back to all the previous threads and refesh your dementia.

Second, you are the one who is repeating such an annoying posts with out making a single valid point.

You are the one, who did not stick with the actual topic and started talking about irrelevant subjects...............

You are the one, who doesn`t even read or even understand simple english and then start accusing me for no apparent reason.

You are the one , who has no tolerance for others. You are the one, who is absoultely unable to take the pressure of healthy debates.

Look, at the end you have started abusing me,by calling me absurd, stupid .

Even though I believe you do not make any sense in any of your posts. Still, I respected your points of views and guided towards positive direction. but, it looks like, you wish to be in darkness for the rest of your life, so, be it.......................

PS:-I request you to exercise care in using abusive words for me. You and I have never been personal. If, for some reasons, we disagree, it doesn`t mean , we start butchring eachother by using abusive words and name callings.

I gave you my precious time to discuss with you this topic, you at the end gave me this bundle of abusive gift, which I will remember for ever. Anyways, this is my last post directed towards you.

I will never waste a single moment in discussing anything with an abusive person like you, who doesn`t know, how to respect eachother????

PS:-Please, don`t try to come up with multiple nicks and try to interact with me. My posts are absurd, stupid and with no sense. be careful in future, I request to save your precious time in ignoring my posts. Thank you very much. It was nice interacting with you.

Take care

re:#125 by Salim_Chauhan
Ha, ha, ha.
My dear friend,
You should be a diplomat. What the heck or u doing in chowk?
Sridhar

re:#122 by Zeena
If u want to end this convesation, stop posting absurd,stupid posts directed towards me. You keep saying the same things again and again. This is called ``parrotting``. Do u have by any chance parrot as a pet?
Sridhar

re:#119 by Zeena
You, perhaps, have a problem understanding my post or understanding English.
I said that the logic of ``72 virgins`` is being presented to the young recruits by Hamas for becoming suicide bombers. As i already said, i saw a program on PBS (on suicide bombers) how one suicide bomber, who was captured (in a failed attempt) narrated the story of recruitement, how they were motivated etc etc. The story of ``heaven, virgins`` had an important bearing on the psyche of the young recruits. Most of these recruits are already motivated by hatred for the enemy. To this hatred is added a religous cause and the promise of a reward in the afterlife. Believe me, this is a potent mixture!
Yes, i know it is absurd logic but pray tell me what is the logic behind suicide bombing anyway. Yet there are umpteen number of young recruits in Palestine (recruited actively into Hamas cadre) willing to blow themselves up for what they believe to be a worthy cause. The concept of ``72 virgins`` is a strong motivating factor for them.

(If, palestinians are defending their homeland, they have every right to defend. You are no one to call them names for their own cause. They are NOT attacking India...................all those poor miserable people are doing fighting for their rights..)
Yah, right! Palestenians are defending themselves by blowing up innocent people. Are u defending the suicide bombers here? Looks like u are.
All this has bearing on India too. Not far away from Indian Kashmir, in Pakistani Kashmir and all across the landscape of pakistan, a similar story is being enacted. Young men are actively recruited by jehadi agencies for attaining ``shahadat`` in the liberation of Kashmir. These young men are also promised ``heaven and 72 virgins`` in the afterlife. They go across the LOC to face the enemy and their likely nemesis, the Indian Army.

Besides, i would like to know what goes on in the muslim mind. What makes an executive of an MNC contribute money to a terrorist organization that would blow up innocent people in the Delhi blasts? What is it that motivates young men to give up their lives for what they believe to be a cause but what the rest of the civilized world believes to be acts of terror?
Sridhar

Masadi #125 {``The whole tale of 72 virgins is not mentioned in the Quran, it is a pseudo-historical invented tale, not part of Islam or the Quran. Why dont you write a story about the logic behind how you comb your hair everyday being progressive and all.``}

Masadi,
You mean that these Tally Bans have been killing Shias just for getting french fries in the future - and no tacos?

Yes, if I were suave, deboner, and sophisticated as you mentioned, I would write a story about the logic behind how I comb my hair every day. But, first you should get rid of your Massada complex.

#125, your explanation is sophisticated and all but just one small problem. The whole tale of 72 virgins is not mentioned in the Quran, it is a pseudo-historical invented tale, not part of Islam or the Quran. Why dont you write a story about the logic behind how you comb your hair everyday being progressive and all.

Catastrophic experiences then make it more likely both that people will accept changes and that these changes will not reflect people`s otherwise `best considered` or `thought out` options. ....A little disconcerting commentary on the nature of personal change :(

Thanks for the kind offer. I may take you up on it. Best regards.

Why are there 72 virgins promised to the faithful who lay down their lives? Note, I said ``lay down their lives`` and not just ``lay down.``

I was waiting for many Chowkies to beg for this precious explanation. But, seeing that Kulharee Bhai has already sweetened the issue with talk of raisins, I must hasten this long overdue explanation of why there are 72 virgins for the shaheeds?

Islam, as we all know, has always been a progressive and logical religion. At a time when other religions were banning women from temples, whether they were suffering from periods or not, burning them on their aged husbands` funeral pyres, even when the young grils were alive, burying them alive, as if they were seeds for a female tree, when woman were accused of everything from blame for expulsion from the Garden of Eden to being the source of all diseases, Islam was much more appreciative. Islam allowed women to come to mosques, debate with men, marry and divorce as they pleased, and hold property in their names. Islam limited men to only four wives - something that was unheard of in those days - confining oversexed men to just four partners - and AIDS was not even an issue then.

Now, you ask ``what does this, o wise one, have anything to do with 72 houris?`` Well, I was just getting to that part. Islam, being a progressive religion, was way ahead of its time in marketing. Just as Jewish, Christian, and Hindu males blindly purchase products from shaving gel to razors, from automobiles to underwear, just because some scantily-clad broad on TV is telling them to buy this brand or that, Islam was using broads as far back as the 7th century AD.

If you told a young Muslim buck that he should contemplate giving his life for his faith in return for burial in Medina National Cemetery or to have his coffin wrapped in crescent-studded banner, or for his widowed wife to receive a spinning wheel, he would tell you to go Fuckoyoom.

Islam, a direct ancestor of Madison Ave shenanigans, came up with the promise of not one, not four, but 72 virgins - all beautiful, all appealing, and all obedient. Islam, being a progressive, institution did not neglect the Atif2 and Fuzooluno type of holy warriors (wink wink) and promised them 72 young boys as an alternative. Now, this is straight from the Democratic Party platform logic.

But why 72? Simple, it is divisibe by 4 (the number of wives allowed), it is divisble by 3 (the holiest of numbers, unless you are in AlKayda), and it is divisible by 6 (demi-darjan) and by 12 (darjan). It is also multiplyable by any number you can think of.

Why virgins? and why they remain virgins despite numerous sessions? Anyone familiar with the effects of wear and tear on earth will easily appreciate this elasticity in word and deed provided by the rational religion called Islam.

Enjoy! and don`t forget to test your vest for proper operation.

#118, catastrophies at times have a tendency to upset the ``world taken for granted`` and as such open up new avenues for thought, however as you suggest, it is better to develop critical thought independant of catastrophies- unfortunately that doesn`t happen for the vast majority. Good going with the rest, my email is on the sites with the articles, inquiries are always welcome.

Re: # 122

``Again, I am a person, who believe in all religions, including Hinduism, christianity, jeudism, buddism, sikhism, Islam, and even aethism and communism, socialism.......................I am an open minded person. I have all the religious books, like Gita, bible, Torah, Buddha,Krishna, Gurudanth about baba guru nanak..................................along with Quran in my library.``

lahol........you are obviously not a practicing muslim..........how can you believe in contradicting philosophies at the same time?? You are just a 16 year old who has neither read hinduism not the holy Quran properly and has conciously not been told by her mentors about the blood shed and gore that goes on in the name of all the great religions...................

#120 rsridhar
I have said , bye and take care, many times,but, you are still determined to discuss this irrelevant discussion, which is taking us no where ,but, in a vicious circle, and it has become quite boring to repeat samething over and over again................I hope you will understand this time.............What do you think, by discussing this sort repeatedly will change my views or dieology,no , absolutely NOT....................................Both of us are going towards a dead end.........

Again......Please, read this post carefully ,before you start jumping back and forth with lame excuses to blame me for nothing..................................

Again, I am a person, who believe in all religions, including Hinduism, christianity, jeudism, buddism, sikhism, Islam, and even aethism and communism, socialism.......................I am an open minded person. I have all the religious books, like Gita, bible, Torah, Buddha,Krishna, Gurudanth about baba guru nanak..................................along with Quran in my library. I always read all these holy books with a positive mind and unbiasedness. I always respect them to the extreme, that I place them above all other books next to each other. I believe these are spiritual holy books from God for the humans and for their guidance. I always try to pick up good points from all of them for my guidance and thank God, I always find my answers from all of them. I never disrespect other`s religion like some of you are doing here , humiliating Quran for no reason......................

Again, If, I said Quran is the best holy book , It doesn`t mean that I am comapring Quran with other holy books. I say samething for all Holy books. Yes, all of them are the best books out of all written books..................................

Again, why I sadi only aboiut Quran, b/c you people are only targeting Quran and Islam with your hatred biasedness.................................as if, Quran is the reason of terrorism....Which is absolutely wrong....................Quran is the guidance for All Humanity, like all other holy books are for all of us...........We humans are animals, if, not guided by these great holy books.......So, think befor eyou write...........................

Are you clear in your head.....again, read my posts carefully before start blaming me for anything...........................

Again, this article is Not about Holy books. You people are going astray of the exact topic.
I wonder, why always almost all of you end up in twisting every topic in to this hatefull discussions about Quran, muslims and jihadis and terrorism??????

I am really surprised, why post 9/11 has changed Indians as well to an extreme that they have started calling all muslims jihadis or terrorists and humiliating Quran???
9/11 has affected USA, absolutely not India. Then, why Indians are acting as if they are Americans...In that case, I am also American citizen.....

I believe we should end up this absolutely irrelevant discussion, which has no links with the actual topic. Thanks, it was nice discussing with all of you. take care.

rsihdar
When did Hamas attack India??
This is their right to fight to protect their homes.....................

re: Zeena`s post
(Quran is the greatest Holy book of all times, which is a guide to all humans. Quran is not only for Muslims, it was for all Hindus, Christians, Jews and others as well. Islam is not ONLY for Muslims, it is for whole Humanity`s guidance)
I quoted only some source from an article published in an english newspaper. If u want to contradict it, do it intelligently, not by being emotional.
I cannot accept that Qoran is the greatest book. For u as a muslim, it may be but many non-muslims like me have a problem with that book. Some of its message seem to be straight from the 8th century bedouin Arabia.
You say you have a Geetha in your collection. Are u aware that Geetha has been interpreted by many scholars many times over, and kept current with modern times. There are verses there that calls the hero Arjuna to take up arms and fight the battle but no hindu in his/her right mind has interpreted this as a message for jehad or violence. It is put in the right context.
Perhaps the message of Qoran was meant only for the 8th century Arabia. Muslims should take what is relevant and reject the rest.

(Using names like Gouri and Gaznii for Pakistani missiles again is b/c they are quoted as muslim heros. Now, don`t come up with labelling them as terrorists. May be they were not seen as heros in hindus,but, they are famous for their bravery and great fighting skills)
Well, Alexander is also famous for his fighting skills but Paki missiles are not named after him. Not even after Akbar! They are named after Arab and Afghan barbarians.
Is there a better eg of Pan-islamism which u yourself said in your earlier post (#56) u do not believe in?
I think we must agree to disagree. Now u know where there can be no dialogue, leave aside friendship, between Indians and Pakis. At best, they should learn to live peacefully in their own spheres.
Sridhar

#116 by rsridhar on December 4, 2005 7:09pm PT
re:#106 by kamasutra
Nothing wrong. Only, this logic is being presented by the cleric to the jehadists to motivate them to be suicide bombers (very true in case of Hamas).
Sridhar
This logic is absurd, you know it very well. That is the obvious reason, you are persistently trying to involve all muslims, hamas, or others in to this illogical fascist misinterpretations.

So, in your point of view, all of them are fighting just for having 72 virgins after death. How much wrong, you could go???

You are just disolving their cause of defense for their homeland in to this stupid misinterpretation ........

If, palestinians are defending their homeland, they have every right to defend. You are no one to call them names for their own cause. They are NOT attacking India...................all those poor miserable people are doing fighting for their rights......

masadi ji

We hope that our search for the truth, to the extent it is humanly feasible, doesn`t await the experience of catastrophic life experiences. Catastrophes have a bad habit of leaving us, in their wake, weakened from the inside and vulnerable to manipulation from the outside. Despairing of future and seeking quick fixes to problems of the past, in the period immediately following a personal catastrophe we may lose intellectual vigor and independence - the absolute prerequisites for staying rational in a complex world.

I know from personal experience what you mean by ideology ruling over reason. Unfortunately, the only cure for the addiction of hero, nation, religion worship is the realization that no hero, nation, or religion that relies for its good reputation on deliberate shading of the truth, distortions of commonly known facts, and invention of new facts by mangling the meaning inherent in commonly used language can be worthy is our allegiance. Or lay claim to being anything good or Godly.

If they are of manageable length, I will try to read through the references you provide, including the two references you have listed earlier. I hope I can appeal to you for your help should I run into something I either don`t understand or dispute.

re:#98 by kalihawa
You should be asking Urstruly not me! He is the chowk`s mullah.
Sridhar