Cursed With Scum

just a quote-though i came across this somwhere here at chowk....
. Of all sexual perversions,chastity is the most unnatural.
pehaps u(javed) need not have any repentance--
cheers
waseem

Re: Bina Reply #53

``you might notice that plenty of desi women

are getting a lot of...er...action. Equal

rights rule! ;) ``

I`ve noticed this lately. In some cases, desi women are surpassing desi men in promiscuity.

Although it has little to do with equal rights and more to do with equal needs and the courage to fulfill them I suppose.

You go girls.

Kamran

Actually the title ``a * *hole`` would be somewhat fitting to someone who uses another for personal benefit without caring about the person. Thats called common sense

Socrates was sentenced to death for `Corrupting (the morals of) the youth`, just a thought, nothing more.

I was not talking about emotional experience, though, Omar, now that you mention it, that is a plus too. Face it guys, if you men think that women are too emotional, getting upset over every little thing, I hope you know that we women generally think men are overgrown children, emotionally immature, afraid of their own powerful feelings. It`s hard to respect a race that trembles and grows pale every time the ``L`` word, the ``C`` word, and the ``M`` word are mentioned!

As for the person who asked what do I think about women going out and getting that experience? Honey, actions speak louder than words, and if you haven`t been locked away with the Unabomber for the past ten years, you might notice that plenty of desi women are getting a lot of...er...action. Equal rights rule! ;)

- Bina

Islam does not ask its followers to supress their sexual desires. It is perhaps THE most progressive religion when it comes to sex. Before people distorted it, Islam allowed a couple to contract marriage, both permananent and temporary, without any mullah or witnesses.

It was only after the death of the Prophet that people screwed up everything. And it is not a Shia/Sunni thing either. People have made it a sectarian issue only because the man who banned temporary marriage, Omar bin Khattab, happened to be the most influential figure for Sunni Islam. But it was his personal decision- note he was not not a religious scholar, just a politician when he did this ijtehad- to ban temporary marriage. If it wasn`t for him, Muslims would not have such taboos about sex and boyfriend/girlfriend type relationships.

I found some very good resources on the web about it and, after reading the fatwa of Imam of Al-Azhar university in Egypt, now believe that Muslims, regardless of the school of thought they follow, can benefit from this great law of temporary marriage. For example, there`s a site that has complete information about it from both Shia and Sunni points of view and has extensive references from Siha-e-Sitta and authentic shia and sunni books. Its very logical and makes so much sense. It says, for example (and this is just an excerpt):

``Sexual feelings are strong forces within human beings which are created by God, and like any other force or instinct, should be directed and supervised. Marriage is God`s legislation to direct this very strong force which might otherwise destroy the human being`s prosperity and salvation. Permanent marriage is the most recommended form of marriage, however, there are situations in which for different reasons permanent marriage, where the intention is to construct a family, is NOT possible. Then what should be done in these cases? Can we accept that God has left us on our own in this important issue, or should we expect some legislation in this case as well? If we do not accept temporary marriage, there are two options left:

1)

Sexual promiscuity and licentiousness, with all it`s results. This is what happens (and is promoted by media, Hollywood, etc.) openly in the West, and not very openly in other cultures.

2)

Suppressing all sexual feelings and instincts until a permanent marriage is possible. There are, however, a few problems with this choice:

A)

It is not possible to enforce it in any large scale form, as a general rule for society.

B)

Even if we assume that it can be enforced, it may cause psychological disorders, and many other complexities. Suppressing natural needs and instincts (sexual or otherwise) is not a healthy practice and Islam does not approve of it either.

It is evident that permitting temporary marriage (until a permanent marriage becomes possible) is the best solution. Mut`a is just a sanctification of the boyfriend/girlfriend relationship. Two people may also live together all their lives without marrying. But a marriage ceremony sanctifies the relationship. The couple acknowledge their actions as fulfillment of God`s will and not merely their personal desires. They are under an obligation to God to fulfill their commitment. In a similar way, Mut`a sanctifies what would otherwise be just a boyfriend/girlfriend relationship. ``

While I don`t agree with everything they say but it`s worth a look: http://www.al-islam.org/encyclopedia/chapter6a/

They also have the text and references to the fatwa by Imam of Al-Azhar.

Comments?

Ferozk: #49

No prevention device, be it a condom or a birth control pill or else can be 100 percent effective. Nothing in life can be a certainity a 100 percent of the time.

This is precisely what i was trying to tell Javed, but the msg got cut off.

Incidently Feroz, could you drop me an e-mail at OMAR1974@compuserve.com. I want to discuss something, but not on a public msg board.

OMAR

ha ha. hahahaha. ha. is that good enough? am i the only one who has noticed that this has been moved down to the end of the list before its time at the top is up?

Re: Hijab Man #45

I was not suggesting a bimbo a night routine.
There is little probablity of contracting STDs if you choose your partners carefully and find out their past sexual history. No prevention device, be it a condom or a birth control pill or else can be 100 percent effective. Nothing in life can be a certainity a 100 percent of the time. On the second part: there is no subsitute to real life. You may have aced sex ed, but that means nothing. Academia can never trully reflect how reality exists and no amount of academic learning can prepare you for life. You have to live life to experience it and you can not experience life by learning it in a book or a class room.

Re: Omar1974

Emotional maturity?

That was an interesting caveat to the discussion. I agree with you that women may find men to be emotionally immuture, but what about the emotional state of women themselves? Women, in my opinion, put too much stock in emotions and that can be, occassionally, infuriating. They need to grow up and not be so childish all time so that any trival thing upsets them!

That is one aspect of a relationship which I do not miss; catering to their emotional needs!

Re: Morality and the sins of ``Experience``

Hijab boy, I think your problem might be that you are trying to reconcile your religious morality (premarital anything is bad) with your pop-culture morality (physical contact without emotion is bad).

Now I`m not a religious guy but I do believe that most of our morals do stem from religion and basic humanity. What really confuses me is the alleged ``immorality`` of physical intimacy with someone you don`t have feelings for (after all that is what made it `disgusting` for you). Um...where the hell are we getting that from? Certainly there is no major religion that says that. Premarital sex is considered `immoral` by a lot of desis but it is because it is premarital not because it is pre-feelings. (The commandment is Thou shalt not covet,not thou shalt not covet without feelings)

Now imagine this; This couple`s been married twenty years. They started to drift apart a long time ago. However, they never divorced (lets say for the kids). They don`t care for one another anymore. However, every now and then they still have sex... is that an immoral act? They are having sex with someone they don`t care about.

Now I can understand misleading someone in to thinking that you care for them to score is immoral, but what if both parties know its a purely physical thing. How in the world does that lack of feeling amount to an immoral or a bad thing?

Hijab-boy

(I`m begining to see what made u choose this pseudonym, is this a metaphor for your self enforced social hijab?)

Gotta tell u something lil` Mar-12-99 8:32:48 PST: fozia - Re:Omar

Marriage is not equated with living like a monk or nun...

Re:Ferozk

safe sex isn`t 100% safe, it is really just ``safer`` sex. Like Javed said Condoms aren`t foolproof, and they aren`t even used 100% of the time by everyone. Women sometimes miss taking the pill. If it was so safe, then people wouldn`t still be contracting STDs and having unwanted pregnancies.

And we haven`t even gotten into the emotional costs...

Regards,

Fozia

Re: Fozia post # 36

Practice safe sex......

Karakoram : Re your post #34

Have you considered that Bina and Shandana/Slink might just also be talking about EMOTIONAL as opposed to just SEXUAL experience(s) ? I think Zehra is taking about the same thing, as was Subuhi.

Guys take longer to become emotionally mature. (This is a view i have heard many womyn propound)Maybe thats why society always views an older guy with a somehwhat younger woman as the ideal. I.E 28yroldboy with 22yroldgirl as compatible. Infact i would go so far as to say that womyn find men that are their own age in the early 20s to be somewhat emotionally underdeveloped and immature. Maybe this is an overgeneralization, but if so, it seems to affect many, many people`s social outlook(s).

Comments ?

Re: Ferozk

The only 100% sure fire way of not getting STD`s is abstinence my friend. Animal skin condoms dont protect against STD`s (the animal cells have spaces in between large enough for STD`s to get through) and all kinds of dfects with condoms, especially among the ``neon`` variety.

Guess who Aced Sex ed?

Re: Ferozk

The only 100% sure fire way of safe sex is abstinence my friend. Animal skin condoms dont protect against STD`s (the animal cells have spaces in between large enough for STD`s to get through) and all kinds of dfects with condoms, especially among the ``neon`` variety.

Guess who Aced Sex ed?

Fozia post #36

TAKE THEE TO A NUNNERY ...

(I love that line, always wanted to find an occasion to use it, and i`m only half pulling your leg Fozia) :)