Pakistan Bans Blogspot
Kyla Pasha March 5, 2006
#46 Posted by Jilawatan10 on April 25, 2006 3:30:23 pm
Re: # 2can u tell me brother how can i access the ORKUT here in UAE, i m new here plz help me my email id is : adeelkhan@hotmail.co.uk
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#45 Posted by Jilawatan10 on April 25, 2006 3:28:52 pm
can u tell me brother how can i access the ORKUT here in UAE, i m new here plz help me my email id is : adeelkhan@hotmail.co.uk
#44 Posted by maryamk on March 23, 2006 11:03:14 pm
Try using an Anonymous proxy to access blogspot. You can google to find many free ones. Works for me.
#43 Posted by HasanMahmood on March 11, 2006 12:06:49 am
Re: # 40
Kyla thanks for your reply. I myself have lived under Zia`s rule and firmly believe that censorship is not the answer to anything. However I also know that being a Muslim there are certain lines which cannot be crossed. Pakis handled this matter in a wrong way but mainly to calm the emotions of people. West does the same thing. It is true that their definition of censorship is far different than ours but it is there. If you live in a society you expect to have some lines drawn for you. Unfortunately for you and me and many like us, Pakistan`s lines dont give much space to anyone. But even if it did our religion stops us from crossing a lot of them and in my opinion rightfulel so. Freedom of speech is great but it is not everything like West might make you guys believe.
Kyla thanks for your reply. I myself have lived under Zia`s rule and firmly believe that censorship is not the answer to anything. However I also know that being a Muslim there are certain lines which cannot be crossed. Pakis handled this matter in a wrong way but mainly to calm the emotions of people. West does the same thing. It is true that their definition of censorship is far different than ours but it is there. If you live in a society you expect to have some lines drawn for you. Unfortunately for you and me and many like us, Pakistan`s lines dont give much space to anyone. But even if it did our religion stops us from crossing a lot of them and in my opinion rightfulel so. Freedom of speech is great but it is not everything like West might make you guys believe.
#42 Posted by articulating on March 10, 2006 2:15:43 am
duh......bizarre...i am still posting on blogspot...and people abroad must be reading it!
#41 Posted by aleemb on March 9, 2006 3:24:50 pm
This article is resonates the same one-dimensional perspective that I have been reading elsewhere but the issue is not as straight-forward as you might first think it with strategic political motivations.
Why do you think the Supreme court cared to block the offending websites given the corpus of some 20 billion searchable webpages such an undertaking is stupidity? It is my understanding that the issue of the cartoons when it first came up did not recieve any reaction until a couple of months after being published when the islamic lobby failed to win over the Danish government and boycotted danish products and take a stronger stance. This is the right thing to do isn`t it? As a community of any sort you look for your own or you dissolve.
With that precedent, you can understand why the Pakistani authorities felt obliged to comply with the islamic states with which she has an extradition treaty. Not only compliance, but its also a matter of allying for economic and political reasons.
The call to action, amongst other things included blocking the offending sites and such was the order passed down by the SC. The task of blocking websites is not as simple as you might think it. Technically, you have to manage a blacklist of offending sites. That black list is every growning and and the URLs of the site are constantly morphing. Blacklists for spammers often block entire domains when those domains are found to be repeat offenders. The easiest route and the quickest way for ISPs to comply with SC`s requests was to block the entire domain instead of sidelining from their core business and assign resources to this issue. You might even think that they wanted users to get frustrated and take this up with the authorities which is what we`re seeing right now.
This brings us back to the bigger question of why censor in the first place? Other than the political and strategic motivations I mentioned the answer to the more fundamental question revolving around censorship revolves around individual values. China incubates is communist roots by filtering the Internet through the Great Firewall of China. Cuba doesn`t have Internet either since it`s a communist nation. Social studies conducted regarding remote villages which found themselves exposed to tourism show that once the incubation barrier broke, the villagers found themselves in a sorry state because it ruined their equilibrium.
Islamic values dictate for example that nudity is a strict no-no. For that reason you might not see any islamic settlers in nudist communities in Europe or anywher else. If those communities spread out and became generally acceptable then the core Islamic society would be threatened at their very core beliefs.
You might call it censorship but that is such a naive one-dimensional argument. The internet does not have PG-13 ratings. Every website is accessible by anyone. Would you want your 10 year old children to see nudity on television? On the Internet losing your innocence is only a click away. So if you can censor sex and voilence due to societies` values censoring things around religious values is also perfectly legitimate.
The uproar around Blogger is hardly something to create an uproar about and escalating the issue to vent off on ISPs, the authorities and justice deparment, the Muslim Ummah and the state laws (which are rooted in the Shariah) is just plain irresponsible and misguided.
I hope readers of this article will question their own values first before their knee-jerk reaction. There is a good balance that can be struck freedom and control. Extremes are undesirable on either end. Hopefully this comment will give some perspective on the issue.
Why do you think the Supreme court cared to block the offending websites given the corpus of some 20 billion searchable webpages such an undertaking is stupidity? It is my understanding that the issue of the cartoons when it first came up did not recieve any reaction until a couple of months after being published when the islamic lobby failed to win over the Danish government and boycotted danish products and take a stronger stance. This is the right thing to do isn`t it? As a community of any sort you look for your own or you dissolve.
With that precedent, you can understand why the Pakistani authorities felt obliged to comply with the islamic states with which she has an extradition treaty. Not only compliance, but its also a matter of allying for economic and political reasons.
The call to action, amongst other things included blocking the offending sites and such was the order passed down by the SC. The task of blocking websites is not as simple as you might think it. Technically, you have to manage a blacklist of offending sites. That black list is every growning and and the URLs of the site are constantly morphing. Blacklists for spammers often block entire domains when those domains are found to be repeat offenders. The easiest route and the quickest way for ISPs to comply with SC`s requests was to block the entire domain instead of sidelining from their core business and assign resources to this issue. You might even think that they wanted users to get frustrated and take this up with the authorities which is what we`re seeing right now.
This brings us back to the bigger question of why censor in the first place? Other than the political and strategic motivations I mentioned the answer to the more fundamental question revolving around censorship revolves around individual values. China incubates is communist roots by filtering the Internet through the Great Firewall of China. Cuba doesn`t have Internet either since it`s a communist nation. Social studies conducted regarding remote villages which found themselves exposed to tourism show that once the incubation barrier broke, the villagers found themselves in a sorry state because it ruined their equilibrium.
Islamic values dictate for example that nudity is a strict no-no. For that reason you might not see any islamic settlers in nudist communities in Europe or anywher else. If those communities spread out and became generally acceptable then the core Islamic society would be threatened at their very core beliefs.
You might call it censorship but that is such a naive one-dimensional argument. The internet does not have PG-13 ratings. Every website is accessible by anyone. Would you want your 10 year old children to see nudity on television? On the Internet losing your innocence is only a click away. So if you can censor sex and voilence due to societies` values censoring things around religious values is also perfectly legitimate.
The uproar around Blogger is hardly something to create an uproar about and escalating the issue to vent off on ISPs, the authorities and justice deparment, the Muslim Ummah and the state laws (which are rooted in the Shariah) is just plain irresponsible and misguided.
I hope readers of this article will question their own values first before their knee-jerk reaction. There is a good balance that can be struck freedom and control. Extremes are undesirable on either end. Hopefully this comment will give some perspective on the issue.
#40 Posted by kyla on March 9, 2006 3:16:41 am
Re: # 36
Yes, I live in Lahore. No, I`m not a fan of the PPP, especially Benazir.
There is one single site on blogspot that has the cartoons on it. There are thousands of blogspot sites that have absolutely nothing to do with the cartoons. The PTA hasn`t just blocked the cartoons. All blogspot sites have been blocked.
Blogspot is not an ideological vehicle - it`s not a newspaper, a magazine, a political platform. It`s a tool. You use it to do things. One person used it to show the cartoons. Banning blogspot is like banning hammers - just because one person picked a hammer and killed someone with it doesn`t mean that all hammers should be removed from public use.
I understand the anger over the cartoons and I understand the desire to remove them from pubic view. But this isn`t about removing just them - it`s about taking away access to a lot of other unrelated information, knowledge, thought, and fun. The PTA is negligent and, as someone said, incompetent in this. And perhaps we`ve gotten into the habit of having our freedoms given and taken away randomly. We should break the habit.
Thank you for your comment.
Yes, I live in Lahore. No, I`m not a fan of the PPP, especially Benazir.
There is one single site on blogspot that has the cartoons on it. There are thousands of blogspot sites that have absolutely nothing to do with the cartoons. The PTA hasn`t just blocked the cartoons. All blogspot sites have been blocked.
Blogspot is not an ideological vehicle - it`s not a newspaper, a magazine, a political platform. It`s a tool. You use it to do things. One person used it to show the cartoons. Banning blogspot is like banning hammers - just because one person picked a hammer and killed someone with it doesn`t mean that all hammers should be removed from public use.
I understand the anger over the cartoons and I understand the desire to remove them from pubic view. But this isn`t about removing just them - it`s about taking away access to a lot of other unrelated information, knowledge, thought, and fun. The PTA is negligent and, as someone said, incompetent in this. And perhaps we`ve gotten into the habit of having our freedoms given and taken away randomly. We should break the habit.
Thank you for your comment.
#39 Posted by self on March 9, 2006 2:33:51 am
#34: They did block the IP address. While www.blogspot.com points to the same address as www.blogger.com, blogs hosted on blogspot.com point to 66.102.15.101.
Some people went ahead and created a google group to coordinate efforts and get blogspot unblocked; see http://groups.google.com/group/AGABBIP/.
Some people went ahead and created a google group to coordinate efforts and get blogspot unblocked; see http://groups.google.com/group/AGABBIP/.
#38 Posted by teshah on March 8, 2006 5:25:55 pm
Re: # 36
It is foolish to assume that you can block all the web sites showing the cartoons. You cannot do this now even if you place a total ban on the internet as these would have been downloaded by now perhaps by millions of pcs all over the world. Not only these twelve, but the dirtiest three added to them by the Danish `Ullema` on their own. They are going to commit another folly by taking the matter to the UN. This is all `riakaari`. No genuine feeling for the holy of the holies whose progeny they killed mercilessly and are targetting them even today notwithstanding the mourning processions being taken out regularly for the last fouteen centuries.
I reproduce an extract from a column in the Daily Times of Pakista, dated 15.2.06, lest they think:
``But let us not confuse grapefruits for oranges. Let us understand that the European and modern (Oh, all right, ‘secular’) thinking on the issue of ‘religious freedom’ is not based on “respect for religious beliefs and faith in God Almighty”. We may be hung up on our religion and all that, but for others the ‘respect’ is not for religion per se, but only for the civic right of everyone to make their own religious choices and not suffer any consequences for so doing. Let me ask you: do you seriously ‘respect’ all religions, including all the hundreds of outlandish ones? ``
It is foolish to assume that you can block all the web sites showing the cartoons. You cannot do this now even if you place a total ban on the internet as these would have been downloaded by now perhaps by millions of pcs all over the world. Not only these twelve, but the dirtiest three added to them by the Danish `Ullema` on their own. They are going to commit another folly by taking the matter to the UN. This is all `riakaari`. No genuine feeling for the holy of the holies whose progeny they killed mercilessly and are targetting them even today notwithstanding the mourning processions being taken out regularly for the last fouteen centuries.
I reproduce an extract from a column in the Daily Times of Pakista, dated 15.2.06, lest they think:
``But let us not confuse grapefruits for oranges. Let us understand that the European and modern (Oh, all right, ‘secular’) thinking on the issue of ‘religious freedom’ is not based on “respect for religious beliefs and faith in God Almighty”. We may be hung up on our religion and all that, but for others the ‘respect’ is not for religion per se, but only for the civic right of everyone to make their own religious choices and not suffer any consequences for so doing. Let me ask you: do you seriously ‘respect’ all religions, including all the hundreds of outlandish ones? ``
#37 Posted by HasanMahmood on March 8, 2006 7:33:57 am
Re: # 34
dude just chill. We all know you love India and hate Pakistan. We all know you are probably one of those Guju Hindu who really thinks that Hinduism will rule the world some day. But truthfully, instead of wasting time telling us how good you are try finding out which bar your daughter, mother and sister are dancing in after watching one of your great movies. Just follow the smell of heeng.....
dude just chill. We all know you love India and hate Pakistan. We all know you are probably one of those Guju Hindu who really thinks that Hinduism will rule the world some day. But truthfully, instead of wasting time telling us how good you are try finding out which bar your daughter, mother and sister are dancing in after watching one of your great movies. Just follow the smell of heeng.....
#36 Posted by HasanMahmood on March 8, 2006 7:28:11 am
Banning blogspot or blogger.com is correct if it is showing the pictures. Let me ask you a couple of questions Kyla - Do you currently reside in Pakistan (my guess would be no) and are you a fan of Benazir Bhutto or PPP (my guess would be yes). In any case I understand that freedom of speech is the next big think that we all talk about and a society cannot function well without it but I also believe that there is a limit to what can or cannot be shown even if it is on the internet. Do you really want Pakistan to be like India? And please dont come back with the example of how it is done in the West because I can give you plenty of examples of how censorship works in the West too. I do agree with you that censorship is bad but overall I agree that the decision should be made to block those websites.
#35 Posted by aquaris on March 7, 2006 7:08:28 am
Re: # 34
LOL
...... ROFL...........
.... you are so full of Paki-hatred....
Go take a chill-pill
... By the way.... go visit www.indiatimes.com or any other site....
there is a breaking story for you.... some bastard/s have blassted a Bomb in Venarasi... Killing more then 15-18 people....
Go pick the item.....and create another of your TRADITIONAL posts....!!
LOL
...... ROFL...........
.... you are so full of Paki-hatred....
Go take a chill-pill
... By the way.... go visit www.indiatimes.com or any other site....
there is a breaking story for you.... some bastard/s have blassted a Bomb in Venarasi... Killing more then 15-18 people....
Go pick the item.....and create another of your TRADITIONAL posts....!!
#34 Posted by arjun_m on March 7, 2006 6:54:06 am
#33 by aquaris on March 7, 2006 6:33am PT
He will have to Block the IP .... not the domain.....!!!
Yup...anyone with two sets of grandparents could have figured this out...but the paki blocking by domain didn`t know better..
so not only did they try to block it, as many people have reported, they did a really lousy job of it..and then backed down when the found out it was giving them a bad rep....
He will have to Block the IP .... not the domain.....!!!
Yup...anyone with two sets of grandparents could have figured this out...but the paki blocking by domain didn`t know better..
so not only did they try to block it, as many people have reported, they did a really lousy job of it..and then backed down when the found out it was giving them a bad rep....
#33 Posted by aquaris on March 7, 2006 6:33:05 am
Re: # 32
Sigh....
yoiu still didn`t get it......!!
Ok here is some interesting info....
1
Server Used: [ whois.markmonitor.com ]
www.blogspot.com = [ 66.102.15.100 ]
.........
Registrant:
Google Inc. (DOM-345046)
1600 Amphitheatre Parkway
Mountain View CA 94043
US
Domain Name: blogspot.com
Registrar Name: Markmonitor.com
Registrar Whois: whois.markmonitor.com
Registrar Homepage: http://www.markmonitor.com
Administrative Contact:
DNS Admin (NIC-1467103) Google Inc.
1600 Amphitheatre Parkway
Mountain View CA 94043
US
dns-admin@google.com
2-
Server Used: [ whois.markmonitor.com ]
www.blogger.com = [ 66.102.15.100 ]
...........
Registrant:
Google Inc. (DOM-345045)
1600 Amphitheatre Parkway Mountain View CA 94043 US
Domain Name: blogger.com
Registrar Name: Markmonitor.com
Registrar Whois: whois.markmonitor.com
Registrar Homepage: http://www.markmonitor.com
Administrative Contact:
DNS Admin (NIC-1467103) Google Inc.
1600 Amphitheatre Parkway Mountain View CA 94043 US
dns-admin@google.com
..... So it means in simple terms .... they are two different domains....
Assigned to same IP`s ...or IP block... ( I am not sure if you know about the IP`s)
Which incidently can be done... ( Any idea of How it works.....?? ).... go search the Net for it....!!
...So for any one to BAN or BLOCK.... One domain.... keeping the other OPEN...
He will have to Block the IP .... not the domain.....!!!
and when One was available according to you.... while the other was NOT...
Is a highly far fetched ...... and an ALI BABA Fairy Tale...
These both were available... as verified by ME also Mr Manto.... speaks for itself..
Now the question why some , as you allege were not able to access any one.., It could be a technical glitch as One of the Major / Minor Bandwidth supplier or among in someone`s local DNS server...
To verify what I have posted.... Just go to www.samspade.org and use their online tool for whoIs.... and MAY be ..... JUST MAY Be ..... you would understand ... How it works...
Sigh....
yoiu still didn`t get it......!!
Ok here is some interesting info....
1
Server Used: [ whois.markmonitor.com ]
www.blogspot.com = [ 66.102.15.100 ]
.........
Registrant:
Google Inc. (DOM-345046)
1600 Amphitheatre Parkway
Mountain View CA 94043
US
Domain Name: blogspot.com
Registrar Name: Markmonitor.com
Registrar Whois: whois.markmonitor.com
Registrar Homepage: http://www.markmonitor.com
Administrative Contact:
DNS Admin (NIC-1467103) Google Inc.
1600 Amphitheatre Parkway
Mountain View CA 94043
US
dns-admin@google.com
2-
Server Used: [ whois.markmonitor.com ]
www.blogger.com = [ 66.102.15.100 ]
...........
Registrant:
Google Inc. (DOM-345045)
1600 Amphitheatre Parkway Mountain View CA 94043 US
Domain Name: blogger.com
Registrar Name: Markmonitor.com
Registrar Whois: whois.markmonitor.com
Registrar Homepage: http://www.markmonitor.com
Administrative Contact:
DNS Admin (NIC-1467103) Google Inc.
1600 Amphitheatre Parkway Mountain View CA 94043 US
dns-admin@google.com
..... So it means in simple terms .... they are two different domains....
Assigned to same IP`s ...or IP block... ( I am not sure if you know about the IP`s)
Which incidently can be done... ( Any idea of How it works.....?? ).... go search the Net for it....!!
...So for any one to BAN or BLOCK.... One domain.... keeping the other OPEN...
He will have to Block the IP .... not the domain.....!!!
and when One was available according to you.... while the other was NOT...
Is a highly far fetched ...... and an ALI BABA Fairy Tale...
These both were available... as verified by ME also Mr Manto.... speaks for itself..
Now the question why some , as you allege were not able to access any one.., It could be a technical glitch as One of the Major / Minor Bandwidth supplier or among in someone`s local DNS server...
To verify what I have posted.... Just go to www.samspade.org and use their online tool for whoIs.... and MAY be ..... JUST MAY Be ..... you would understand ... How it works...
#32 Posted by arjun_m on March 7, 2006 4:40:13 am
#31 by aquaris on March 6, 2006 5:43pm PT
and both opens as usual..... and working properly...
It`s working now...There`s plenty of pakis who`lll tell you that they had banned the blogspot.com domain but had blogger.com open..
You and behram and other pakis like you with a single set of grandparents really do have a comprehension problem....
and both opens as usual..... and working properly...
It`s working now...There`s plenty of pakis who`lll tell you that they had banned the blogspot.com domain but had blogger.com open..
You and behram and other pakis like you with a single set of grandparents really do have a comprehension problem....
#31 Posted by aquaris on March 6, 2006 5:43:10 pm
Re: # 26
LOL
should i spell it out .... ... `` Goat Brain ``
they have not...
I have tried both www.blogger.com as well as www.blogspot.com
and both opens as usual..... and working properly...
Now you got it.....!! ..... or something is not rattling...in your Brian..
have a chill pill.... and get sometime OFF your DUTY......and let some Other Code Coolie
do your work for a while... you seem stressed.... By your CUT/PASTE duty...
try www.ahajokes.com for a while..... it will help you release that tension....
which keep building up... every time ... to CUT/PASTE YOUR KIND Off Stuff on this Site..
Mr Behram is Right after all....!!
keep smiling....
......
LOL
should i spell it out .... ... `` Goat Brain ``
they have not...
I have tried both www.blogger.com as well as www.blogspot.com
and both opens as usual..... and working properly...
Now you got it.....!! ..... or something is not rattling...in your Brian..
have a chill pill.... and get sometime OFF your DUTY......and let some Other Code Coolie
do your work for a while... you seem stressed.... By your CUT/PASTE duty...
try www.ahajokes.com for a while..... it will help you release that tension....
which keep building up... every time ... to CUT/PASTE YOUR KIND Off Stuff on this Site..
Mr Behram is Right after all....!!
keep smiling....
......
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