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The Pakistani Fast Bowling Enigma

F Zamanov June 21, 2006

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listing 1-16   1 2 3

#38 Posted by knshaikh on November 18, 2006 4:13:32 am
A thought provoking article!

I think currently there is a big problem in Pakistan Fast Bowling specially after ban on Shoaib Akhtar and Asif.
This problem will be apparent specially on South African Tour by Pakistan Team.
The way to solve is to give all the domestic top performers a chance in the A team matches and take them to foreign tours.
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#37 Posted by HasanMahmood on June 29, 2006 11:54:42 am
Re: # 36
lol - I love when people get personal. Didnt your mother teach you not to use foul language. This message leads me to believe a couple of things about you. First you are probably living outside of Pakistan and really think you are it when it comes to cricket. I would assume you are in England or America. Secondly calling yourself ``uno`` leads me to believe that you are too full of yourself. That would make me infer that you are from Lahore. Thirdly, After a full stop you are supposed to use Caps. So fix that issue. Lastly I really do have very little experience in dealing with or interacting with a complete nincompoops. If you wanna call names then how about obtuse, or dense, or dim-witted, or thick. But wait isnt that what they called you sister or was it your ammi jaan???? That is why I just used the word ``ass``. After all I know that your behna and ammi dont have a great ass but you might be working out ;)
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#36 Posted by faisaluno on June 23, 2006 1:26:54 pm

retard, your absolute lack of any reasoning ability leads me to believe that you have very little experience of interacting with people other than with your mohallay kay laundays who exist to congregate at the konnay waali paan kee dukaan. learn to stitch together a couple of coherent sentences together if you want to avoid being a laughing stock.
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#35 Posted by HasanMahmood on June 23, 2006 11:23:32 am
Re # 31

I love when people get personal lol. Well Mr. Investment Banker or whoever youi are here are the facts:
yes they defended very well in on Pakistani wickets and yes they can play spin (oooh but nothing new), however the same team could not win the series against a bad West Indies team. Aww now that is a real fighter. Oh and how about the great series they had in Autralia. Well wait, how about them losing the last 4 one days against India in Pakistan because of bad captaince and decision making.
Wait now I know why pakistanis will never win. because people like this Investment banker really think that they know about Cricket because they were born in a cricket playing nation. Now tell me you were one of those who played really well but could not make it to the team. Well idiot, if you watch cricket and know aout cricket as much as I do then you will know that Inzi is a very bad captain who makes wrong decisions and if they are lucky and they win everything is good but if they lose, stupid ass people like you dont hold him accountable. Oh also were you really happy when under Wasim Bari`s selection this team tanked in the world cup; he was fired and by some twisted reasoning was brought back to select the team again. By the way just pointing out the good things that the Pakistani team did does not make your point valid but maybe you know that because after all you are an investment banker. I really hope your parents should have tried harder with you but maybe you were the middle child. Now sit down and pray for Pakistan to win the world cup because it might not happen as you believe but then I have also heard the hell might freeze over.
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#34 Posted by impressions on June 23, 2006 11:12:37 am
Re: 33

What happens when you take 20 opposition wickets? Ok, there could be a tie. Also you could bowl out the opposition twice and yet have the match drawn because it rained or you just ran out of time with a chase.

But 95% of the time when you take 20 opposition wickets you win. You said it would be requisite to take 20 aussie wickets in each game. What did you mean by that? Tied tests?

I`m done with this, man.
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#33 Posted by Brother_Zamanov on June 23, 2006 10:43:22 am
Re: #32

No where in my write-up did I say that Pakistan should clean sweep Australia, and the purpose of posting my original last paragraph was to show people like you that based on the editor`s deleting a few words one can take the jist of the argument out of context.

I will repeat once again, the intent of this whole piece is to offer factual arguments to question and improve the organizational practices of the PCB, the richest public institution in Pakistan. It is a sport loved and watched by all segments of Pakistani society and given the national resources and energy we spend on playing and following it there is no reason we can`t aim to be #1. Any organizational improvement within this sport can serve as an example for the rest of the country.

If you slept a little less and offered some concrete suggestions (instead of blowing `imaginary` holes in others) on how to improve Pakistan`s ranking from #4 in Test cricket to #1, I would be happy to discuss it in a civilized way with you.

Peace
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#32 Posted by impressions on June 23, 2006 8:35:04 am
Re: 23 (If it werent for righteous indignation, this website would have vanished on day one)

Bhai Ruskee,

Don’t worry yaar I definitely will go back to sleep. I’ve been here since day one and I just dont have the time or the inclination anymore. But lets wrap this up before I doze off.

Don’t dilute your claim now. You very clearly said that the barometer for Pakistani fast bowling attack is to take out 20 Aussie wickets in Australia in all matches. I did not misquote you. Not one bit.

For example you cant say that in order to demonstrate that there is no systemic malfeasance in the Pakistani Athletic establishment, a Pakistani must run the 100 in 9.80. And then if someone challenges you, you say, “Oh I just meant that a Pakistani sprinter should do well at international competition”.

You gave a specific yardstick and that yardstick was just plain silly. As a writer your words ought to mean something or you have no integrity.

For example you cant say that we are attacking Iraq because they have WMD and then after you fail to find them say, “well we found some barrels and there’s all this evidence from Chalabi and Curveball so they must have been trying to get the WMD. Surely they are in Syria now``.

Integrity my friend.

Anyway, I don’t mean to nitpick. I kid you because I care. Lord knows we don’t have enough people writing about pure endeavors like sports. Everyone just wants to hurl their feces at each other.

Okee dokee then. Beddy bye time.
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#31 Posted by invst_banker on June 22, 2006 4:54:14 pm


as insinuated in post 28, here are examples of pak team ``crumbling under pressure`` in test matches over the last season:

1. defeating england in the 1st test match in multan by defending a target of 195 in the second innings.

2. defeating india in karachi to win the test and the series after being down 29 for 6 on the first morning of the test match

3. batting 4 sessions (120 overs) in second innings of the 1st test match against s.l. on a turning wicket against the deadliest spinner ever to play the game to save the test match.

4. scoring 180 in the second innings of the second test match against s.l. to win the test and the series again on a turning wicket against the deadliest spinner ever to play the game.

i might also add here that the real reason why pak will never be able to compete with countries like australia in any field is because our country is filled with half brained chimpanzees like hassan mahmood masquerading as human beings.
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#30 Posted by rf786 on June 22, 2006 1:59:10 pm
Re: # 29
Yes we have a cricekt academy, A-teams, domestic circuit and local clubs which means a proper system in place, but when it comes to team selection how much does this infrastructure contribute? Take the example of our bowling attack, had it not been injuries to Shoaib and Rana, Shahid Nazir wud still be waiting for that magical call. Fazl e Akbar is still waiting like many other very talented young lads. Same is in the spin dept, Pakistan has yet to try a new spinner and keeps going back to the ageing but chummy Mushtaq Ahmed, if he cannot play so what he is hired as the bowling advisor simply because he is Inzis old buddy. Why does Pak continue to struggle with their opening partnership? Simply because we do not honor those players who have performed in domestic circuit and continue to favor players with no respect to merit or committment to the domestic system. Some players get special favors while some are deliberatly sidelined, this happens in vacum created by individuals dominating and dispensing established systems.

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#29 Posted by HisExcellency on June 22, 2006 1:08:38 pm
re: #27

The first two reasons are understandable, the last one is not. We already have a proper system in place. There is an A-team, an under-19 team. There are cricket academies in Karachi and Lahore. PIA, UBL, WAPDA, KRL etc have their own teams. They pay these people to play cricket. Cricketers earn enough to get gym memberships.

Are you talking about centrally managing cricketers and then ensuring they don`t play more than a certain number of games per year? How will such a system prevent cricketers from playing in English county season, charity matches and other unofficial games?
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#28 Posted by HasanMahmood on June 22, 2006 9:42:19 am
Re: # 16
``as far as defeat to australia is concerned, that was to be expected given the the talent and the experience levels of aussie players as well as their work ethic. ``

I love this idiot comment which implies that our team can never be as good as Australians. So them beating us is expected. This is the kind of Pakistani mentality that we have to get rid of. Yes we have been ruled by British for a long time but it is time to come out of that slave shell. By the way there is no nonsense in this article. You pointed one false thing and you were called upon for that. Just because Imran is critical of dropping Sami does not make him a great bowler. He is average and you should know better. Reminding us of Pak beating other teams is a greatthing for us ignorant fools but have you seen Pakistanis crumble under pressue or do you have an answer for that too.

By the way Shobig, Miandad was never the batting coach and Wasim andWaqar have been given the opportunity just now.
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#27 Posted by rf786 on June 22, 2006 9:41:32 am
Re: # 26
Lack of proper training facilities, weak to non-existent culture of physical training at school level and most importantly, desperate need to utilize available reources w/o proper system in place
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#26 Posted by HisExcellency on June 22, 2006 9:12:37 am
That we need fast bowlers is clear. Pakistan produces the most fast bowlers per capita than any country in the world. But most have short-lived careers due to injury.

Imran Khan suffered a stress fracture at the peak of his career and didn`t bowl for two years. We tried Rashid Khan, Azim Hafeez, Tahir Naqqash and Sikandar Bakht but none of them provided any teeth to our attack. As a result, Pakistan fared poorly in World Cup `83 and Australian tour of 1984/85.

Imran`s protege Wasim Akram suffered a groin injury during World Cup `87. We had to play an erratic Salim Jaffer in his place. This cost us the semifinal against Australia in Lahore. Years later, Wasim suffered shoulder injuries that prevented him from playing in the crucial World Cup quarter-final against India.

Waqar Younis, another protege of Imran, devastated New Zealand and West Indies in a home series... and then suffered a stress fracture in his back just before the World Cup `92. Luckily his absence didn`t prove very costly. But that recurring injury forced him to change his bowling action and reduce his speed.

Another rising star, Muhammad Zahid, impressed on the 1996/97 tour to Australia. He made Brian Lara and Justin Langer dance on the wicket in his debut series. Yet he suffered a leg injury three months later and has never been seen since then.

And now Shoaib Akhtar, the world`s fastest bowler... is a poster child for orthopedic surgeons. Umar Gul isn`t that fast but even he suffered a stress fracture of the back in 2004.

So what`s wrong? Do they need better physical trainers? Do they need supporting wickets? Are they too young & physically weak for fast bowling?
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#25 Posted by ahmedmadani on June 22, 2006 12:12:05 am
Some thing wrong Worlds fasted bowler R.Pindi Express is not considered is Blasphemy
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#24 Posted by rf786 on June 21, 2006 11:22:32 pm
Bowlers win test matches
Batsmen win one days

These are two basic principles of cricket which dictate performance most of the time. One day cricket which is more of a circus than anything else is geared in favor of batting to please the viewing audience, no one wants a ONE DAY match to end in Twenty overs. Test cricket is a different ball game, both teams play two innings and are required to bowl the other side out twice. Granted, strong batting lineups do matter, but its a genuine bowling attack which makes all the difference.

Writer is correct in emphasizing the importance of established systems, it basically motivates domestic players to improve their game, provides an even playing field, avoids any controversy and promotes a culture of merit. Yes, we should not discard Pakistan`s policy of allowing talented players the chance to perform, but that should not be used as an excuse to manipulate or discard established system.
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#23 Posted by Brother_Zamanov on June 21, 2006 8:26:13 pm
Re: #21

My original submission to chowk had this for the final paragraph, parts of which were edited out by their staff:

``When a Pakistani team can go to Australia and get 20 opposing wickets in every test match, or at least put the fear of God ( i.e. the Cricket God ;) in their batsmen, only then can we truly say that this is a world class team with the best available talent. Until then let`s seek solace in the fact that the national cricket team will be a bunch of under-achievers who can come close (due to the sheer natural talent of a few) but can never finish the job or be #1. The present system although producing good teams but not world-beaters and thus must be improved with all selections being fair and meritorious. This cricket-crazed country and its poor people deserve at least one world-class organization (besides the khakis!) that makes it proud. God please let it be our cricket team!``


Before you get untreatable insomnia, read the piece again and try to understand the central theme. It`s about the injustice meted out to the top performers in the domestic league and the inconsistent selection policies. A trait common to many other organizations in Pakistan. Yes Australia is an extremely tough team to beat at home, but with a potent attack and courageous batting you can give them a run for their money. As HisExcellency has kindly stated it has been done before and Pakistan can do it if they plan appropriately and keep selecting the right people. According to your hypothesis, no one should even dream of beating Australia and Pakistan should just roll over everytime they tour Down Under.
You need to go back to your slumber before you start debunking arguments with your sense of righteous indignation. Unfortunately another common trait found abundantly in Pakistan.
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listing 1-16   1 2 3

Interact Index

    #38 knshaikh
    #37 HasanMahmood
    #36 faisaluno
    #35 HasanMahmood
    #34 impressions
    #33 Brother_Zamanov
    #32 impressions
    #31 invst_banker
    #30 rf786
    #29 HisExcellency
    #28 HasanMahmood
    #27 rf786
    #26 HisExcellency
    #25 ahmedmadani
    #24 rf786
    #23 Brother_Zamanov
    #22 HisExcellency
    #21 impressions
    #20 HisExcellency
    #19 bjk
    #18 Brother_Zamanov
    #17 Brother_Zamanov
    #16 faisaluno
    #15 rf786
    #14 shobig_sifar
    #13 HasanMahmood
    #12 HisExcellency
    #11 atif2
    #10 shobig_sifar
    #9 muqaddam
    #8 harish_hyd
    #7 bjk
    #6 rozaiba
    #5 WitchDoctor
    #4 sanjay
    #3 farhanfaiz
    #2 paindupastry
    #1 rf786

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