Posted by
soundmeister
Oct 13, 2004 11:03 pm
this is old news. but i don`t really blame naipaul, if he`s sensitive soul that he comes across as in his books, for being irritated by indian audiences. truth is- we don`t know how to conduct ourselves in public. we shuffle endlessly, allow our mobile phones to ring and horrors, even answer them in loud voices, block others` views, call out to friends across the room, talk among ourselves if the topic isn`t gripping enough, ask ponderous, inconsequential questions, or the other extreme, don`t ask any questions at all and look around uncomfortably for someone who has perhaps listened to the speaker to make the first move, we don`t do any basic research on the speaker or the topic and come there expecting to come up to speed on the fly, as it were. we`re a disgusting audience, and if naipaul and his wife were kind enough to point it out to us, it`s best that we say a humble sorry and learn how to conduct ourselves as civilised human beings before pointing fingers to someone who has obviously done this many times before, across the world.
When Darcy and Lalita get laid…
Posted by
soundmeister
Oct 13, 2004 11:03 pm
One more thing... the title is thoroughly misleading... darcy and lalitha do NOT get laid in this movie... with the Austen-Bollywood combine, is that even thinkable...tauba tauba.... there`s just one kiss...woh bhi masked by the sunset and which quickly turns into an embrace :))))
When Darcy and Lalita get laid…
Excellent critical analysis. Eveything you have said iabout the movie is true. Even though I admit I enjoyed the movie, these irritants kept popping up in the back of my mind throughout.
Still, the movie has its high points- Aishwarya looks gorgeous as usual (she turns 31 next month, who can tell!) Namrata Shirodkar as the eldest Bennett is well cast and very believable. The movie stays fairly faithful to Austen`s original, though the kitsch and stilted dialogue sort of get in the way. The secondary characters are nicely fleshed out, though some like sister ``Kie-ran`` could have been eliminated completely. I liked some of the jokes, Ash sweetly asking Kholi/Kohli ``Does your house have 3 swimming pools?`` being remniscient of the innocent humour Chadha displayed in ``Bend It...``
If Gurinder Chadha has a fault, it is that she panders thoroughly to stereotypes. In this case, these stereotypes are not even shared by her self-declared `taraget audience`. They are the `typical Indian` cliches that leave one wincing. The film could safely have been subtitled ``India through the eyes of an NRI``, cuz it aint the India we know!
Posted by
soundmeister
Oct 13, 2004 09:50 pm
FarzanaExcellent critical analysis. Eveything you have said iabout the movie is true. Even though I admit I enjoyed the movie, these irritants kept popping up in the back of my mind throughout.
Still, the movie has its high points- Aishwarya looks gorgeous as usual (she turns 31 next month, who can tell!) Namrata Shirodkar as the eldest Bennett is well cast and very believable. The movie stays fairly faithful to Austen`s original, though the kitsch and stilted dialogue sort of get in the way. The secondary characters are nicely fleshed out, though some like sister ``Kie-ran`` could have been eliminated completely. I liked some of the jokes, Ash sweetly asking Kholi/Kohli ``Does your house have 3 swimming pools?`` being remniscient of the innocent humour Chadha displayed in ``Bend It...``
If Gurinder Chadha has a fault, it is that she panders thoroughly to stereotypes. In this case, these stereotypes are not even shared by her self-declared `taraget audience`. They are the `typical Indian` cliches that leave one wincing. The film could safely have been subtitled ``India through the eyes of an NRI``, cuz it aint the India we know!
Is Islam Anti-Semitic?
Main Entry: Sem·ite
Pronunciation: `se-``mIt, esp British `sE-``mIt
Function: noun
Etymology: French sémite, from Semitic Shem, from Late Latin, from Greek SEm, from Hebrew ShEm
1 a : a member of any of a number of peoples of ancient southwestern Asia including the Akkadians, Phoenicians, Hebrews, and Arabs b : a descendant of these peoples
2 : a member of a modern people speaking a Semitic language
1Se·mit·ic
Pronunciation: s&-`mi-tik also -`me-
Function: adjective
Etymology: German semitisch, from Semit, Semite Semite, probably from New Latin Semita, from Late Latin Semitic Shem
1 : of, relating to, or constituting a subfamily of the Afro-Asiatic language family that includes Hebrew, Aramaic, Arabic, and Amharic
Funnily enough, the same M-W defines `anti-semitic` thus
an·ti-Sem·i·tism
Pronunciation: ``an-ti-`se-m&-``ti-z&m, ``an-``tI-
Function: noun
: hostility toward or discrimination against Jews as a religious, ethnic, or racial group
Like Dharam-paaji said, ``English is a very funny language``.
Nice read, BTW.
Posted by
soundmeister
Oct 13, 2004 09:50 pm
How can Islam be anti-Semitic? Merriam-Webster defines ``Semite`` asMain Entry: Sem·ite
Pronunciation: `se-``mIt, esp British `sE-``mIt
Function: noun
Etymology: French sémite, from Semitic Shem, from Late Latin, from Greek SEm, from Hebrew ShEm
1 a : a member of any of a number of peoples of ancient southwestern Asia including the Akkadians, Phoenicians, Hebrews, and Arabs b : a descendant of these peoples
2 : a member of a modern people speaking a Semitic language
1Se·mit·ic
Pronunciation: s&-`mi-tik also -`me-
Function: adjective
Etymology: German semitisch, from Semit, Semite Semite, probably from New Latin Semita, from Late Latin Semitic Shem
1 : of, relating to, or constituting a subfamily of the Afro-Asiatic language family that includes Hebrew, Aramaic, Arabic, and Amharic
Funnily enough, the same M-W defines `anti-semitic` thus
an·ti-Sem·i·tism
Pronunciation: ``an-ti-`se-m&-``ti-z&m, ``an-``tI-
Function: noun
: hostility toward or discrimination against Jews as a religious, ethnic, or racial group
Like Dharam-paaji said, ``English is a very funny language``.
Nice read, BTW.
The New Wife
I love the way you retain the rustic flavour in your translations. Anyone who has read Premchand in the original would recoginse it instantly. I read ``Nirmala`` as part of a chool project once but at that time I was too young and only thought it ``depressing``.
Nice build-up this story has! Perhaps a few elements are lost in translation, but otherwise a nice read.
Posted by
soundmeister
Oct 12, 2004 09:48 pm
Godot,I love the way you retain the rustic flavour in your translations. Anyone who has read Premchand in the original would recoginse it instantly. I read ``Nirmala`` as part of a chool project once but at that time I was too young and only thought it ``depressing``.
Nice build-up this story has! Perhaps a few elements are lost in translation, but otherwise a nice read.
The Return of the Court Jester
Can you provide subtitles for the cartoon in #7?
Posted by
soundmeister
Oct 8, 2004 06:51 am
Urstruly,Can you provide subtitles for the cartoon in #7?
Here’s looking at me…
so the last bastion crumbles. the supreme rationalist has bowed before the new god. how soon before you change ur name to ffarzaaana versei?
Posted by
soundmeister
Oct 8, 2004 06:51 am
how can it be ``self-hypnosis`` if the man in the checked suit who looked like a greasy trader did it to you? unless he hypotnised himself and saw himself as a lady in a tiara on a hilltop and you ``internalised`` that as well.so the last bastion crumbles. the supreme rationalist has bowed before the new god. how soon before you change ur name to ffarzaaana versei?
Letter to Prime Minister of India
so in your opinion, only ``mass murderers`` are deserving of censure? terrorists blowing up schoolbuses and flattening trains and marketplaces is perfectly kosher?
btw, it was the punjab problem that first introduced most Indians to the word ``terrorism``. so to listen to one of those preach piety to the elected head of state is- forgive me- a little hard to swallow.
those responsible for the sikh lynchings of `84 need to be put in jail, or worse, no question. the sad thing is it`s people like you and me who should be baying for it and not the author. he lost his moral right to preach the day he shot his first innocent.
Posted by
soundmeister
Oct 8, 2004 06:51 am
stuka,so in your opinion, only ``mass murderers`` are deserving of censure? terrorists blowing up schoolbuses and flattening trains and marketplaces is perfectly kosher?
btw, it was the punjab problem that first introduced most Indians to the word ``terrorism``. so to listen to one of those preach piety to the elected head of state is- forgive me- a little hard to swallow.
those responsible for the sikh lynchings of `84 need to be put in jail, or worse, no question. the sad thing is it`s people like you and me who should be baying for it and not the author. he lost his moral right to preach the day he shot his first innocent.
“Final” solution?
The question is not whether Gandhi has become irrelevant in the modern context- simply because his teachings of non-violence, passive resistance and simple self-sufficiency were so basic- but whether it`s time the holier-than-thou state of Gujarat called its own bluff and joined the real world. For decades Gujarat has been labeling itself the land of the Mahatma and consequently finds itself today in a strange position- the only Indian state that imposes prohibition consumes the highest amount of alcohol in the region, the state with a sizeable (and relatively `mainstream`) Muslim minority that various riffraff organisations claim as their ``Hindutva laboratory``, whatever that means. Not to mention the fact that the leftist press/NGO combine has gone about painting the whole state as if it were filled with babykillers and rapists, impacting not just Gujarat but all of India`s image in the world.
A pity really, considering that Gujarati traders were (and continue to be) the life blood of the economic capital of the country, Mumbai. Most Gujjus define the archetypal Great Indian Middle Class, but some have gone beyond it to greater things (Ambanis come to mind). On the whole, they are pleasant, highly resourceful, entrepreneurial folks, with a tendency to be rather shrewd, overbearing and loud, but basically harmless. That`s why the Gujarat violence left so many wondering- what the hell happened?
Well whatever happened, the state has to live with the repercussions for many years to come. I doubt too many MNCs will rush to set up shop in Ahmedabad or Baroda anytime soon. They already dislike it because of the alcohol issue anyway.
Posted by
soundmeister
Oct 6, 2004 11:17 pm
re: #55 hindviThe question is not whether Gandhi has become irrelevant in the modern context- simply because his teachings of non-violence, passive resistance and simple self-sufficiency were so basic- but whether it`s time the holier-than-thou state of Gujarat called its own bluff and joined the real world. For decades Gujarat has been labeling itself the land of the Mahatma and consequently finds itself today in a strange position- the only Indian state that imposes prohibition consumes the highest amount of alcohol in the region, the state with a sizeable (and relatively `mainstream`) Muslim minority that various riffraff organisations claim as their ``Hindutva laboratory``, whatever that means. Not to mention the fact that the leftist press/NGO combine has gone about painting the whole state as if it were filled with babykillers and rapists, impacting not just Gujarat but all of India`s image in the world.
A pity really, considering that Gujarati traders were (and continue to be) the life blood of the economic capital of the country, Mumbai. Most Gujjus define the archetypal Great Indian Middle Class, but some have gone beyond it to greater things (Ambanis come to mind). On the whole, they are pleasant, highly resourceful, entrepreneurial folks, with a tendency to be rather shrewd, overbearing and loud, but basically harmless. That`s why the Gujarat violence left so many wondering- what the hell happened?
Well whatever happened, the state has to live with the repercussions for many years to come. I doubt too many MNCs will rush to set up shop in Ahmedabad or Baroda anytime soon. They already dislike it because of the alcohol issue anyway.
Letter to Prime Minister of India
Posted by
soundmeister
Oct 6, 2004 09:32 pm
what fun. a `Khalistani leader currently in jail in Nabha, Punjab` (presumably not for petty theft) in a `small but radical Sikh journal` complaining about the `84 and Gujarat violence. hi kettle, this is pot, dude you`re black!
Ironies
a little cynical compared to your usual stuff huh? Also, if you`ll forgive me, a trifle derivative. Surely not all these are original? (sound very familiar)
but a good read, nevertheless. particularly liked
statue
men of marble
suffer pigeon droppings
in silence
dieting
who ever heard
of the famished
fretting over carbs
firearms
guns kill
no, people kill
pity, no one asks the dead
politicians/NGOs
over roast lamb
in a/c tents
they discuss poverty
(the last one I don`t agree with, but I like anyway!)
Posted by
soundmeister
Oct 6, 2004 09:32 pm
t, a little cynical compared to your usual stuff huh? Also, if you`ll forgive me, a trifle derivative. Surely not all these are original? (sound very familiar)
but a good read, nevertheless. particularly liked
statue
men of marble
suffer pigeon droppings
in silence
dieting
who ever heard
of the famished
fretting over carbs
firearms
guns kill
no, people kill
pity, no one asks the dead
politicians/NGOs
over roast lamb
in a/c tents
they discuss poverty
(the last one I don`t agree with, but I like anyway!)
The Return of the Court Jester
btw, I liked the chicago lawyer`s `tasteless` jokes that malik has reproduced :)
shazia mirza also I`ve heard of, someone had writtena piece on her on chowk if memory serves right.
us subcontinentals could do witha healthy dose of good-natured self-deprecation now and then. we take ourselves way too seriously.
Posted by
soundmeister
Oct 6, 2004 09:32 pm
may their tribe increase.btw, I liked the chicago lawyer`s `tasteless` jokes that malik has reproduced :)
shazia mirza also I`ve heard of, someone had writtena piece on her on chowk if memory serves right.
us subcontinentals could do witha healthy dose of good-natured self-deprecation now and then. we take ourselves way too seriously.
Musings of an Immigrant on Culture and Identity
we`re a bit of a pompous ass now aren`t we?
cheers
Posted by
soundmeister
Oct 6, 2004 07:52 am
dear jai pathak,we`re a bit of a pompous ass now aren`t we?
cheers
Cold Metal
you need to ponder on what is unsaid rather than what is said here. A suggestion- look at it from the point of view of the guilt of the `inadequate` son, not quite a prodigal- and you may begin why the cold, distinctly aloof, detached approach is necessary.
Posted by
soundmeister
Oct 5, 2004 08:42 pm
t-bhaiyou need to ponder on what is unsaid rather than what is said here. A suggestion- look at it from the point of view of the guilt of the `inadequate` son, not quite a prodigal- and you may begin why the cold, distinctly aloof, detached approach is necessary.
The Doll’s House
In Modi`s Gujarat, Hitler is a textbook hero
HARIT MEHTA
TIMES NEWS NETWORK[ THURSDAY, SEPTEMBER 30, 2004 05:11:36 AM ]
AHMEDABAD: Gandhi is not so great, but Hitler is. Welcome to high school education in Narendra Modi`s Gujarat, where authors of social studies textbooks published by the Gujarat State Board of School Textbooks have found faults with the freedom movement and glorified Fascism and Nazism.
While a Class VIII student is taught `negative aspects` of Gandhi`s non-cooperation movement, the Class X social studies textbook has chapters on `Hitler, the Supremo` and `Internal Achievements of Nazism`.
The Class X book presents a frighteningly uncritical picture of Fascism and Nazism. The strong national pride that both these phenomena generated, the efficiency in the bureaucracy and the administration and other `achievements` are detailed, but pogroms against Jews and atrocities against trade unionists, migrant labourers, and any section of people who did not fit into Mussolini or Hitler`s definition of rightful citizen don`t find any mention.`` They committed the gruesome and inhuman act of suffocating 60 lakh Jews in gas chambers`` is all the book, authored by a panel, mentions of the holocaust.
The section on `Ideology of Nazism` reads: ``Hitler lent dignity and prestige to the German government within a short time by establishing a strong administrative set up. He created the vast state of Greater Germany. He adopted the policy of opposition towards the Jewish people and advocated the supremacy of the German race. He adopted a new economic policy and brought prosperity to Germany.
He began efforts for the eradication of unemployment. He started constructing public buildings, providing irrigation facilities, building railways, roads and production of war materials. He made untiring efforts to make Germany self-reliant within one decade. Hitler discarded the Treaty of Versailles by calling it just `a piece of paper` and stopped paying the war penalty. He instilled the spirit of adventure in the common people``.
A few classes junior, students in Gandhi`s home state read that the Bapu really may have been overrated. In the chapter on `Gandhian Era and National Movement`, there`s a section sub-headlined `The Negative Aspect`.
Posted by
soundmeister
Sep 30, 2004 07:38 am
Read the following piece from today`s TOI with an open mind, and you will begin to see how little separates liberalism from total paranoia in this countryIn Modi`s Gujarat, Hitler is a textbook hero
HARIT MEHTA
TIMES NEWS NETWORK[ THURSDAY, SEPTEMBER 30, 2004 05:11:36 AM ]
AHMEDABAD: Gandhi is not so great, but Hitler is. Welcome to high school education in Narendra Modi`s Gujarat, where authors of social studies textbooks published by the Gujarat State Board of School Textbooks have found faults with the freedom movement and glorified Fascism and Nazism.
While a Class VIII student is taught `negative aspects` of Gandhi`s non-cooperation movement, the Class X social studies textbook has chapters on `Hitler, the Supremo` and `Internal Achievements of Nazism`.
The Class X book presents a frighteningly uncritical picture of Fascism and Nazism. The strong national pride that both these phenomena generated, the efficiency in the bureaucracy and the administration and other `achievements` are detailed, but pogroms against Jews and atrocities against trade unionists, migrant labourers, and any section of people who did not fit into Mussolini or Hitler`s definition of rightful citizen don`t find any mention.`` They committed the gruesome and inhuman act of suffocating 60 lakh Jews in gas chambers`` is all the book, authored by a panel, mentions of the holocaust.
The section on `Ideology of Nazism` reads: ``Hitler lent dignity and prestige to the German government within a short time by establishing a strong administrative set up. He created the vast state of Greater Germany. He adopted the policy of opposition towards the Jewish people and advocated the supremacy of the German race. He adopted a new economic policy and brought prosperity to Germany.
He began efforts for the eradication of unemployment. He started constructing public buildings, providing irrigation facilities, building railways, roads and production of war materials. He made untiring efforts to make Germany self-reliant within one decade. Hitler discarded the Treaty of Versailles by calling it just `a piece of paper` and stopped paying the war penalty. He instilled the spirit of adventure in the common people``.
A few classes junior, students in Gandhi`s home state read that the Bapu really may have been overrated. In the chapter on `Gandhian Era and National Movement`, there`s a section sub-headlined `The Negative Aspect`.
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