It\'s A Deal After All! yeah as some said 100,000 crore rupess are behind it or

100,000,00,00,000 rupees or

2000,00,00,000 dollars approximately (2000 crore)

or 20,000,000,000 (20,000 million, 20 billion)

the US congress would not laugh this off.....

DM (T)

Free to Breed Re: # 11 interesting new, zeemax.
would it be possible for you to post tha news item here or on UP - ofcourse with a translation (some here - like are are Urdu challenged) )

K2, the Savage Mountain "Usually half dead reach the summit"

Yes! That captures K2 - Goodwin-Austin whatever you might want to call it. More deadly than Everest Climb - a climb (from I have read elsewhere and here - fraught with more dangers and gradients).

Thanks for this great article. And that first line (I quote above) captures the essence very well (T)

Aafia Siddiqui to Appear in Court Re: # 68

If they dont like it they can move out to a place where they can get justice of their kind....

As it is these people are fighting for a cause (nothing wrong by itself) .... but using violent methods and killing and maiming their own citizens...that is the issue...atleast they are getting their justice...so stop complaining.

Fissures in the Middle Majumdar you are a swantantra party man...

Fissures in the Middle Zeemax: 269:I thought the protection of citizens was the responsibility of the Government. Is he promoting vigilantism? But that's exactly what the other side is promoting too

Mushy and his Kitchen Cabinet winning again....anarchy...chaos...and people clamouring for order...viola Army ktichen Cabinet back in the driving seat...

Fissures in the Middle musharuff and his inner kitchen are winning all the rounds..so far---hail Musharuff

Whether Mushy is following the WOT agenda or not is not the issue here. they have used the agenda for their purposes and they are winning.

(a) They have shown the Pakistanis how bloody inept the civilian elite are at managing themselves.

(b) They shown the pakistans how poor they are at managing the economy.

(c) They shown the pakistanis how inept the Civilians politicians are in their thinking
two examples:
(i) The ISI blunder
(ii) The position and volte-face on the IAEA vote
Both of these two items were never thought through comepletely, in their entierity.

(d) The real civilian-authority is in Dubai and not in Islamabad or Karanchi or Pindi

(e) the most efficient industries are those run by the Army. They have shown the rest of the elite (feudal and otherwise) to be abunch of no-good carpet baggers.


Mushy and his Kitchen Cabinet are winning the rounds hands down. Every step, every move is calculated for this. You can see the treatment meted out to Gilani in the US in this light and it starts to make sense.

Hail Musharuff. Musharuff - all ahil him.

Feminist Mumbo-Jumbo! parthaab....for you man...you can sort of get your act together and join these folks

http://498a.wordpress.com/2005/08/15/law-to-harass-2/

Government Wins Manmohan Singh Loses Re: # 56 Neither arjun.

as you go through more reincarnations some of those brain cells are not being regenerated.....:(

Roshni a very well written piece...gripping and you captured the moment very well. Esp, the character of Alamgir....

Government Wins Manmohan Singh Loses Re: # 30 It is now even more incumbent on India to follow the non-proliferation rules - irrespective of who is in power... so India has to vote along with the US and others on this.

Government Wins Manmohan Singh Loses Re: # 32 that goes without saying harimau (T). WE should do it the chinese way....

Government Wins Manmohan Singh Loses Re: # 28 yes. But there is very little that can be done ...the safe guards are for the civilian reactors, and new uranium obtained from now on.

With old material, there is very little that can be done. Secondly, it is incumbent on all parties to adhere to agreements. If one party reserves the the right to abrogate international agreements (generally multilateral) then it is open season. So if the US tests, China tests, russia tests, India will test. but this is in the realms of castle in the air.

What is more important is "whether india has the taste for being a patrolling partner on the non-proliferation issue"? That is the real test. The rest as they say is just add-ons.

Government Wins Manmohan Singh Loses Re: # 26 Django, may you live a thousand years (or what ever is the saying), and I was reading the eConomist on this

http://www.economist.com/world/asia/displayStory.cfm?story_id=11779444&a mp;a mp;source=features_box3

and you are on the money (T) ;)

The outcome was a particular triumph for Mr Singh, who has waged a lonely campaign on behalf of the nuclear agreement. The indifference exhibited by many in Congress towards it has been almost as problematic as the Communists’ opposition. Free of these trials, the deal—or, more precisely, a safeguards agreement required by it—is now expected to go before the IAEA’s board of directors on August 1st. If the board approves, the 45-member Nuclear Suppliers Group will be asked to rewrite its rules to accommodate the deal. America’s Congress would then be asked to give a final blessing to the arrangement.

Government Wins Manmohan Singh Loses Re: # 22 One the things people forget is that nuclear material is diferent from any other resource. Every gram of it has to be accounted for, and every gram of it can be traced. There are international agreements on this, and india has been (or has become) a signatory to these treaties, The Nuke deal adds to this.

thus if any material got under the deal goes missing (or is unaccounted for), india could be in the same situation as Iraq, saddam and the WMDs. in Iraq, this materail went mising, and no one believed Saddam when he said he did not have ...and this material is even now missing - where has it gone...your guess is as good as mine.

Thus it is important that India adheres to all such agreements and treaties. Even for weapons testing, it cannot use material got under this treaty....then India is in trouble (as DM says in #22). If India were to use its own material not obtained under the safe guards regime (the para quoted t DM some time back), or pre-existing material India can get away with it.

But what this agreement does is to make India a partner to the Non-proliferation deal, and make it a patrolling partner ...ala U.K. Whether this is India's cup of tea or not is something which time will tell.

Dont hold your breath regarding power/energy....this is not what the deal is about.....that is just the Indian Industrial houses wet dream (esp Ambani's). This deal is about non-proliferation, and making use of India for some future purpose.

India had a first test of its role as a responsible country (re:non-proloferation patrol partner) when it voted against iran at the IAEA. the next test is coming soon, when Iran comes up again....that is the real deal of this deal.

Government Wins Manmohan Singh Loses ekalavya, dont get me wrong....here...MMS has done something which is far more important and better than what BJP managed to do.....(all the while keeping the nuke deterent intact..there has been no capping of it...).and in this I agree with Sid Varadarajan when he says and I quote:

IN THE fullness of time, last week's nuclear agreement between India and the United States will be seen as one of those decisive moments in international politics when two powers who have been courting each other for some time decide finally to cross the point of no return. The U.S. and India have `come out', so to speak, and the world will never be the same again.

Every world order needs rules in order to sustain itself but sometimes the rules can become a hindrance to the hegemonic strength of the power that underpins that order. Following India's nuclear tests in 1998, the U.S. had two options: continuing to believe the Indian nuclear genie could be put back, or harnessing India's evident strategic weight for its own geopolitical aims before that power grows too immense or is harnessed by others like Europe or China. The U.S. has chosen the latter option, and the joint statement released by President George W. Bush and Prime Minister Manmohan Singh on July 18 is the most dramatic textual manifestation of what Washington is attempting to do.

India too, had a choice. It could use its nuclear weapons status as a lever to push for a multipolar world system as well as for global restraints on the development of weapons of mass destruction. Or it could use its status as an instrument to help perpetuate an order based on the production of insecurity and violence in which it eventually hoped to be accommodated as a junior partner. The erstwhile Vajpayee Government was never interested in the former option and longed desperately for the latter. The fact that Dr. Singh has managed this is the real source of the BJP's bitterness, not the fact that India's nuclear weapons capability is to be capped (which it is not).

Ref: http://www.globalresearch.ca/index.php?context=viewArticle&code=VAR20050729& amp; amp;articleId=756

For those who believe that this ia capping of the Indian deterent should carry on reading the analysis, and it says

"By integrating India into the non-proliferation order at the cost of capping the size of its eventual nuclear deterrent," Ashley Tellis argued in a recent monograph, "[the U.S. would] threaten to place New Delhi at a severe disadvantage vis-à-vis Beijing, a situation that could not only undermine Indian security but also U.S. interests in Asia in the face of the prospective rise of Chinese power over the long term" (India as a New Global Power: An Action Agenda for the United States, Carnegie Endowment for International Peace, 2005). This, then, is the real value of the deal in American eyes and the Indian public should be aware of it.


Sid my man, goes on to say Of all the misgivings present in the public mind, it is the fear of a quid pro quo on some other front that the Prime Minister most needs to dispel. It is this aspect of the deal which MMS has not been convincing enough. I do not see anything anywhere from the minister or the govt on this apsect. This is what is worrying, the blithe matter of fact manner in which the likes of Sibal et al are going about today (in fact the vote went through) makes me wonder.