Fatima Bhutto Fighting for Justice
On UP, Sadna quotes Rafiq Zakaria who spoke to A.V.Alexander, one of the members of the Cabinet Mission

[Jinnah stood his ground and asserted : 'Fear is the most potent weapon; I am sure the rulers in either state will be wise enough to conduct themselves properly. They will be afraid of retaliation against their co-religionists.']

The telling confession of the subcontinent’s first Islamic terrorist – and his worship of fear as a weapon!

Fatima Bhutto Fighting for Justice Re: # 323

DM-jee, I respect your age and stuff. However, I am aware that you, like Sanatani, were directly affected by the tragedy of the Partition - like countless other individuals on both sides of the border, including the Dr. Gill. Therefore, it is virtually impossible for any of you (in my view) to make an objective evaluation of Gandhiji - who many victims of the Partition blamed for "pampering Muslims" - as the term went.

Gandhiji was many things to many people - but one thing he was not was - he was not a dishonest person. I have especially resented the attempt on the part of some on this site to present him as such a person. I have every reason to believe that such individuals are either dishonest themselves or have their own compulsions for doing so.

In case it is necessary to explain, let me tell you that "over my dead body!" is a rhetorical phrase and is not to be taken literally! Please also keep in mind that at the time you were a child yourself and therefore highly susceptible to views expressed to you by other people who were even less objective.

I agree that the support for Gandhiji among the Indian Muslims of the 1920's - 1930's was lukewarm at best. However, that for the Muslim League was not much better - it was just as lukewarm. Things changed in the aftermath of the Congress Rule of several states after the sweeping victories in 1936-37 elections. The massive use of the spoils system by the Congressmen scared off many Mussulmans (who were apprehensive to begin with) and sent them into Jinnah's camp. Many Muslim grievances were exaggerated but the complainants feared (wrongly) they were witnessing a Hindu Raj being created. I personally see an analogy with how the South African whites had felt (a few decades later) when the black South Africans were ready to assume power. Jinnah was of course very obliging in building up that apprehension. When that racist Churchil came to power, he had not the slightest hesitation in taking advantage of the Hindu-Muslim divide - because his objective was to prolong the Raj as much as possible. Along with the Jinnah, the numerous "Princes" and small royalties were also VERY willing to collaborate with the Britishers for their own selfish interests.

Every one of those entities watched out for their own narrow, selfish interests (Jinnah most of all!)...

Except for Gandhiji! He tried to help every insaan and he put his own neck on line in the process.

Also, BTW, let me ask you what I asked Sanatani - to which he was unable to provide an answer.

Even if we assume that by following Gandhiji, the Indian Hindus came out a cropper - well, WHY did they follow him anyway?!

Was he holding a gun to their heads?

Fatima Bhutto Fighting for Justice Re: # 316

[Because of vermin like you and your ilk. Self haters and back stabbers all.

Because Shri Godse thought strategically and not tactically.

Because the Sardar loved Gandhi more than he loved the country.

Because Harimau Iyer will never see beyond reservations and attempt Hindu Dharam Asmita.

Because Masanmuthu will not see beyond Harimau's casteist abuse as the rantings of an extremely marginalised and now oppressed caste and see OBC cruelty as an expression of Sanatan Dharam.

Because all hindus who otherwise behave as Bhangis have this strange notion of caste superiority.]

Sanatani my dear, with so many hurdles present already to the process of building what would be a "Hindu Pakistan", why do you single out the Mahatma Gandhi as the cause of your catastrophe?

If Hindus lack a "vision", is that Gandhiji's fault? He did give us a vision - only it was ABOVE the vision of Hindu unity that you appear to seek - it was the vision of uniting mankind. Jinnah had the narrower vision. Therefore, it failed. You wanted Gandhiji to descend to the level of a Hindu Jinnah. That is impossible because that is not what he was about. And by some magic, if that WERE possible, I assure you he would have failed like the Jinnah did.

If you got what you call "vermins and self-haters" shouldn't you be focussing on them rather than beating up on Gandhiji?

How do those "vermins and self-haters" get empowered? Aren't those elected by the masses? Do you even believe in a democratic setup?

My dear, you need to sort your own thoughts through before you go about on that spree of mouthing foolishness about Gandhiji.

Fatima Bhutto Fighting for Justice Re: # 308

[But could not muster the courage to take it to a logical conclusion.]

Why not?!

Fatima Bhutto Fighting for Justice Re: # 308

[People like you are a curse to the Sanatan Dharam, Hindu Samaj and Bharat Mata.]

Sanatani my dear, can you name ANY Indian leaders whom you would consider as "not a curse to the Sanatan Dharam, Hindu Samaj and Bharat Mata"?!

Fatima Bhutto Fighting for Justice Re: # 303

Sanatani my dear,

Let's leave aside Gandhiji's unorthodox experiments for cures to physical ailments and his brahamcharya! Those were not the characteristics which made him popular among the masses.

Face it, my dear, it is not Gandhiji you are truly upset at. You are really upset at the Indian masses - the vast droves of ordinary Hindus - who connected with him and who followed him IN SPITE of his unorthodox views on side issues.

What is YOUR explanation for it, sir?! Do you have any special insight or knowledge which the average insaan did not have and YET they followed him nevertheless?!

And BTW, the vast majority of Indian Muslims preferred to stay put in India because they LIKED it there! It is called voting with your feet. It does not matter that many of their forefathers were misled (or junooned) into voting for Pakistan. It was a stupid thing to do and those same people, had they been alive, would now cry like a baby to look at the end results.

As far as the butchery and other hardships that the Partition-displaced people underwent (on both sides of the border) are concerned, the blame should be placed squarely upon the people who committed those atrocities and perhaps equally on the people who brought that event about!

Your Shri Jinnah being the chief culprit!

Fatima Bhutto Fighting for Justice
Correction in #304

Change Fatima Jinnah to Fatima BHUTTO!

Kambakhat Jinnah must be haunting me! Rats!

Fatima Bhutto Fighting for Justice Re: # 302

Au contraire, my dear Zee, it is you who is being devious!

In fact, the little sis detests mullahs and although she is innocent, perhaps a bit like Fatima Jinnah – she can never fall to their trickery and chaalbazi!

So forget any dreams of taking advantage of her innocence and of fooling and co-opting her! Stop pretending to be a well-wisher while in reality pursuing your very own (foolish) agenda.

It has been well-demonstrated, through countless posts from my little sis that – given half an opportunity – she would pluck (your) graying mullah beards all the way from their roots…she would pull so hard that not only the beard but anything else connected with it – perhaps the entrails as well as your (superficial) indicators of (false) masculinity – would come yanked out! And then she would happily offer the same to her pet canine for its morning repast.

Therefore, you ought to - for the sake of physical integrity alone - cease and desist!

Chasing a Mirage: The Tragic Illusion of an Islamic State Re: # 99
[What you're writing today may make you repent tomorrow.]

Tahir miaN, do you take that fact into consideration while posting those numerous spams?!

Fatima Bhutto Fighting for Justice Re: # 296

Pakistan3, the little sis has a heart of gold and when everything is said and done, that's all that remains and counts - not the superficial labels!

Fatima Bhutto Fighting for Justice Re: # 298

[After my interactions here on Chowk, one thing I have learned about Pakistan is that it is no less pluralist and no less democractic than any other country]

...and then you woke up, of course!

Fatima Bhutto Fighting for Justice #276 Kulharee

Yaar, that's highly unfair. First, Ms. Fatima Bhutto is not a politician but a poet. Second, she has shown no interest in any of those shady deals which Pakistani politicians, khakis, mullahs, etc. make left and right. Her interest is limited to bringing to light the circumstances of her dad's death and hopefully - and this is clearly a long shot - bring to some sort of justice those who were responsible. My good wishes and prayers are with her.

Sometimes, you Pakistanis - especially the males - can be so cruel that I am glad to disclaim any association with you all!

Fatima Bhutto Fighting for Justice VRV,

Zeemax is a foolish jihadi idiot. There is no need to respond to any of his countless moronic posts.

Fatima Bhutto Fighting for Justice Re: # 260

Masadi miaN, have you taken into account the possibility that Manto LIKES you - hence including your name?!!

Chasing a Mirage: The Tragic Illusion of an Islamic State
#42 Hamidm2 miaN

[...... most pathans are not homosexuals, but they see nothing wrong with homosexuality and are simply bisexaul - it is part of their islam ..... i am sure that you know that babur, inspite of all the women he had, loved only baburi - a boy ........ i have also heard that homsexuality is rampant in al-lah's kingdom of saudi arabia, not because the men are homosexuals, but simply because they don't have any access to women ..... and over time this behavior becomes acceptable without people fessing up to it ........ the most virulent opponents of homosexuality are closet homos like the catholic priests, evangelical ministers, edgar j hoover, prophets and our own mullahs .......]

LOL!

Hamidm2 sahib, you got a point there, especially regarding the NWFP. I quote the following from Lawrence James’ book on British Raj. (The reference to Forster is to E. M. Forster, who wrote A Passage to India (1924).)

“Contemporary law banned any explicit references in fiction to sexual contacts between British and Indians. Forster knew about them, probably in some detail, through his shipboard meeting in 1912 with Lieutenant Kenneth Seabright of the Queen’s Own (Royal West Kent Regiment), with whom he later stayed at Peshawar. Seabright was a homosexual with an enthusiastic and insatiable appetite for teenage boys, and he seems intuitively to have recognized Forster’s latent homosexuality, as did some young Indians. The young subaltern, who struck Forster as a Byronic figure, was already at work on an epic poem which recorded in lubricious detail his encounters with various Indian partners, whose colour excited him. Paradise for Seabright was the North-west Frontier, where his tastes were abundantly cared for:

And now the scene shifted and I passed
From sensuous Bengal to fierce Peshawar
An Asiatic stronghold where each flower
Of boyhood planted in its restless soil
Is – ipso facto – ready to despoil
(Or be despoiled by) someone else; they yarn
Indeed so has it that the young Pathan
Thinks it peculiar if you would pass
Him by without some reference to his arse.”

Fatima Bhutto Fighting for Justice Re: # 257

Ras sahib, your advice to Ms. Fatima Bhutto is well intentioned, of course, but most likely, she is about as likely to see it as Mr. Dalrymple is likely to come here and interact. :((

However, it is sensible advice. Politics is dirty business. Its rough-and-tumble world is no place for young idealists which all poets (irrespective of age) are.

There is no reason to cast doubts on Mr. Dalrymple, though. He is not a player among this cast of characters. Come to think of it, even Fatima is an "outsider" - directly affected though she is.

Your advice to her to get married and have a family of her own is rather patronizing, though.