Why not hang Surabjit Singh? raheel07,

As for the fishermen's issue, it's tragic that these ppl who make livelihood by fishing on high seas are caught as if they stole the state secrets on high seas! It’s laughable to say the least. Indian/Pakistani Coast Guards can turn them away but there lies the fundamental reason of recurrence of trespass.

Fishermen in India and Pakistan operate with kerosene as fuel to run the 19th century boats. They dont have fishing harbours to dock their boats and store their catch in cold storages. The whole cycle of operations is still rudimentary. They bring the catch and their daughters & wives do separation and grading of the catch. The dealers come and buy the catch and cart off the goods to markets.

I talked to some fishermen who venture to high seas. They always say good things abt Pakistani fishermen. They exchange food and cigarettes on high seas. They help each other like a community.

Now forget abt GPS or any sort of communication setup for May Day messages for those hundreds of boats that venture out to Arabain sea everyday, they even dont have modern day boats that are equipped to be helpful to fishermen in all aspects of their tasks. They still use kerosene lamps at nights. Keep their catch in the hull of the boats

So in a way these ppl are innocent in aspects of the word coz they don’t have:

1. Proper fishing boats
2. No Fishing harbours with cold storages
3. No GPS or any sort of communication system to know their position on high seas

The ANP Challenge Brother Salman,

Thanx for exposing Mantolives thoroughly. Good Job.

The Irreverent Hero Islam Forgot Cheema,

hamid2 is always around to make fun of all religions. It's quite an envious job.

The ANP Challenge Dear Salman,

I had it with him since I joined Chowk (2006) and I still want to give him benefit of doubt it he talks sense, coz we all make mistakes.

Ejaz Gul and Zakkk gave good perspectives to this tussle (btw Jinnahites and Ghaffarites) & it shud be that way..........i.e. live for the present and the future.

Yasser never learns :(

Why not hang Surabjit Singh? #31 Posted by Urstruly on March 24, 2008 11:58:16 am

What punishment does Musharraf is eligible for for the murder of hundreds - if not thousands - of Pakistani citizens?

N.B: I think the next of the kin of the victim(s) pardoned Sarabjit.

The ANP Challenge Salman,

Pl quote the Wolpert's paragraph.

The truth is that Jinnah actually regretted violence (he gave press statement on the next day, I think) and that's for record and it's a way of making an alibi to avoid legal implications in the form of criminal conviction.

Even if Jinnah regretted violence, how can he absolve himself of the frenzy building up to DAD?

U can see what Muslim Leaguers said and what the mouthpoce of Muslim League said. They called it jehad and compared it with al Badr (since the DAD was declared during Ramzaan period). We cant ignore the symbolism that goes with DAD.

Nobody wud imagine that Jinnah wud say blood-curdling statements abt smashing innocnets with crowbars & iron rods. These small detals are for the AIML cadre to take care of & the SW's job to facilitate the Plan.

++

U can notice the way this lawyer thinks. He wants to DEFER the argument abt Sherpao since he's advised abt Bhutto's hand in it but wants to think that Khan family INDEED bumped him off as per the EVIDENCE HE HAD!

U can see the magic of his thinking!

The ANP Challenge Zakkk,

Though u seem 2 sympathise with KKK but u sound very balanced and that's what I expect of this young lawyer all the time. U know, he disappoints us at Chowk.

Unfortunately Yasser said again that the KHANdaan were crooks!! Why this hyperventilation??? Who's a bigger crook than Jinnah? Yasser thus brought back the debate to the starting point again.

Venkat & others,

Jinnah was the chief architect of the major developments that conributed to the formation of Pakistan (no Independence, pl note). He took each and every decision with a singular purpose of carving out Pakistan outta British India. He took all vital policy decisions and presided over such decision making processes.

If violence - actually it's Indian Holocaust - happened then Jinnah is solely responsible since he's the benefactor of those developments.

Why not hang Surabjit Singh? Killing i/0 killings

caught in this i/o caught int his

Why not hang Surabjit Singh? ...we put this behind us...

Why not hang Surabjit Singh? I dont know how Manjit planted bombs in both Multan and Lahore at the same time!

Killings innocents is not an exclusive terrain of any group, country or individuals. India/Pakistan does this to each other. Pakistan does in its own country & so does India for her citizens. America does this in Pakistan and Afghanistan. Unfortuately only a few perpetrators are caught in this and sent thru this charade of dispensing justice. Mistaken or otherwise Sarabjit fits in to this category of ppl who was caught int his game of India and Pakistan.

As for death penalty, it's the curiousity aspect that grips us asll whereas Indian/Pakistan police kill ppl routinely in encounters, lock-ups and thru collusions (criminals, anti-social elements). May be we dont protest if Sarabjit is killed by police in India by Indian police in lock-up or encounter.

India is not a paragon of HR virtues.

It's the time we put his behind us and exchange prisoners (not necessarily one2one but state2state) and move ahead. Death penalty debases us as human beings.

If killing 14 ppl is the crime that Sarabjit got to go to gallows, how many death penalties shud Musharraf got to undergo?? Unfortunately, it's the BIGGER criminal (Musharraf) who's deciding the fate of the smaller criminal (Sarabjit).

The Irreverent Hero Islam Forgot jayp,

Wud u make little of Panchatantra?

Pl read that book.

The ANP Challenge Yasserbhai,

Stew in ur own juices. I'd come back tmrw. I have a life to live and job to do.

In the meanwhile keep propping up ur article and provoke more posts and be called a successful writer.

Good luck.

Salman,

If Yasser ever tries to be in politics, pl see that this guy is opposed as he never want peace with India but perpetual war.

The ANP Challenge FOR THOSE INTERESTED IN HISTORY OF DIRECT ACTION DAY:

Sir Francis Tuker on Direct Action Day (relevant portions are culled for the sake of brevity): Mr. Tuker is in-charge of the army of Eastern command.



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Direct Action Day speech by Suhrawardy:

.........Direct Action Day would prove to be the first step towards the Muslim struggle for emancipation..............


Sir Francis Tuker :

Our intelligence patrols noticed that the crowd included a large number of Muslim goondas, and that these slipped away from the meeting from time to time, their ranks being swelled as soon as the meeting ended. They made for the shopping centres of the town where they at once set to work to loot and burn Hindu shops and houses.



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The ANP Challenge In the meanwhile I quote these portions from Freedom at Midnight by Larry Collins and Dominique Lapierre. Both Collins and Lapierre are Hindus (wink) and Congressmen (double wink).

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Page 33:

At the dawn on 16 August, howling in a quasi-religious fervour, Moslem mobs had come bursting from their slums, waving clubs, shovels, any instrument capable of SMASHING IN A HUMAN SKULL. They came in answer to a call issued by the Moslem League, proclaiming 16 August `Direct Action Day`, to prove Britain and Congress Party that India`s Moslems were prepared `to get Pakistan for themselves by ``Direct Action`` if necessary`.

They savagely beat to a sodden pulp any Hindus in their path and stuffed their remains in the city`s open gutters. The terrified police simply disappeared. Soon tall pillars of black smoke stretched up from a score of spots in the city, Hindu bazars in full blaze.


Page 34:

The threat that Muslims had been uttering for years, their warnings of cataclysm which would overtake India if they were denied their own state, took on a terrifying reality.

(MANTO, THE AUTHORS ARE WRITING ABT PEOPLE LIKE YOU!)

History, beyond that written by his own people, would NEVER ACCORD MOHAMMED ALI JINNAH THE HIGH PLACE HIS ACHIEVEMENTS MERITED.

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The ANP Challenge Harish wrote:

#506 Posted by harish_hyd on September 18, 2006 11:36:05 pm
#500 by Mantolives

Collins and Lapierre`s book was entirely based on Mountbatten`s views...

Prove it. Just because you say it doesn`t mean it is true. And we all know your track record.

Jinnah of Pakistan is by Stanley Wolpert- an American, .....

Wolpert in his book Gandhi`s Passion says it was Muslim mobs that started the cycle of violence in Calcutta on August 16th.

I`ve found no evidence of muslim league involvement in calcutta killings and appreciably larger number of Muslims died than Hindus

So how is the fact that more Muslims died evidence of the ML`s innocence?

Tomes have been written about how the ML`s provocative language and Jinnah`s aggressive overtures could lead to violence. Almost every newspaper foresaw what was going to happen. Suhrawardy, Jinnah`s blue-eyed boy, declared a holiday to the Police despite the tense atmosphere on August 16 and Jinnah did squat about that. The man himself was sleeping on the floors and didn`t speak a word to his constituency about stopping the violence until after 5 days when the violence had died down.

And yet Yasser thinks Jinnah was innocent...sure...

The ANP Challenge Sir Francis Tuker :

Our intelligence patrols noticed that the crowd included a large number of Muslim goondas, and that these slipped away from the meeting from time to time, their ranks being swelled as soon as the meeting ended. They made for the shopping centres of the town where they at once set to work to loot and burn Hindu shops and houses.

I wud also like to repeat the Memoirs of Suhrawardy:

MEMOIRS OF SUHRAWARDY
University Press Ltd ,Bangladesh

Pl hear this from Horse mouth:

Background to DAD:

At this time, betraying the Muslim cause, the Viceroy called upon Pandit Nehru to form an interim government which he did, but the Muslim League refused to participate in it Jinnah even cancelled his talks with Lord Wavell, the Viceroy, and proclaimed 16 August as Direct Action Day.

On Why DAD was active in Calcutta not elsewhere:

The one-member majority Muslim League government in Sind, formed after the assassination of the Congress Chief minister Allahbux, was also asked, but, because it was a shaky government, its Muslim League members could not be trusted. So, all the risks of the Direct Action Day fell on the Bengal government On that day Muslims were expected to gather in large numbers to proclaim their adherence to the concept of Pakistan Shaheed Suhrawardy declared a holiday for that day in Calcutta

Suhrawardy`s explanation to Wavell on bloodshed:

The Viceroy wanted to know from Prime Minister Suhrawardy how he could be held responsible for the riot. Suhrawardy explained that the riot was a consequence of the formation of the interim government without Muslim League representation.......

Replication of DAD in other states? Read this.....

He further warned that what had happened in Calcutta would repeat itself all over India unless the British government changed its policy.



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It`s very clear from the two key people in Bengal, it was Muslim League that started the cycle of communal holocaust. Unlike u, I cant poohpooh ur data of who died more, coz I need to check them. If u take the 2-3 months of Bengal violence and give them as DAD violence then u go back and forth to the politics of Muslim League. They stand as the main accused in all the communal violence in United India. If u go back further to the violence of all invader kings then it was the natives who died more than Muslims.

Lets limit our details 16th August i.e Direct Action Day, then u stand accused of lying again!! Lying btw, is ur second nature, no doubt.

It`s more than clear that u want to invent history and wipe-off the sins of Muslim League! Supporters of violence wud perish one day. Pl rememebr the story of Jewish story? A person ignored the violence since it was not his town, street. By the time his turn came, there`s nobody left to speak for him.